In episode 202 astrologers Kenneth Miller and Sam Reynolds join Leisa Schaim and Chris Brennan in the studio to talk about the history behind Pluto’s significations, as well as the meanings of the other outer planets in general.
This discussion is partially based on a paper that Kenneth wrote for the second volume of The Ascendant journal, titled “Pluto’s Weird History: Dumb luck? Dumb note? Dumbbell?”
In the article Kenneth chronicles the development of Pluto’s significations by astrologers after it was discovered in 1930, and the surprising lack of consistency until the mid-1970s.
This ended up being the basis for a sweeping discussion about how astrologers develop interpretive meanings for new celestial bodies, and some of the pros and cons for different approaches.
Sam and Kenneth were in town this week for a planning meeting with the rest of the board of the International Society for Astrological Research (ISAR), which is hosting their next astrology conference here in Denver in September of 2020.
We decided to take the opportunity while they were in town to meet up and get to the bottom of this whole outer planet issue.
This episode is available in both audio and video versions below.
Here are some timestamps for topics covered at different points in the episode:
00:04:58 Kenneth’s Pluto article in The Ascendant
00:08:43 Sam’s perspective on outer planets
00:14:39 Political issues of outer planets
00:16:03 Brief history of outer planets
00:18:30 Rulership scheme
00:19:25 Indian tradition and outer planets
00:20:27 Shortcoming of traditional astrology criticisms
00:23:48 Thema mundi and masculine and feminine
00:24:40 Does astrology need to adapt to modern society?
00:28:10 The hiddenness of the outer planets
00:31:08 Different views of function of Pluto
00:33:52 Multi-valence of Pluto
00:35:00 The Pluto keyword Sam dislikes
00:40:00 Pluto’s demotion from a planet
00:42:04 Outer planet significations
00:46:07 Therapeutic blaming of the planets
00:47:30 Haphazard naming of outer planets
00:56:57 Robert Hand’s influence
01:04:30 Pluto, Scorpio and the 8th house
01:05:50 Focus on Pluto in modern astrology
01:11:40 Influence of cultural beliefs
01:13:09 Trend in names of new planetary bodies
01:17:10 Lack of modifiers for the outer planets
01:20:12 How to talk about Pluto to a beginner
01:25:10 Octaves and overlap of inner and outer planet significations
01:33:04 Outer planets and profections
01:34:40 Transiting Neptune on the ascendant
01:36:00 Nocebo effect with outer planets
01:37:41 Rise of mythology in 20th century
01:39:40 Synchronicity in naming of planets
01:41:50 Pluto of less importance since its demotion?
01:48:50 Using caution with new discoveries
01:51:52 Keiron Le Grice
01:53:15 Alan White quote about Pluto
01:54:15 Closing remarks
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