The Astrology Podcast

Transcript of Episode 281, titled:

December 2020 Astrology Forecast

With Chris Brennan, Austin Coppock, and Kelly Surtees

Episode originally released on November 29, 2020

Original episode URL:

https://theastrologypodcast.com/2020/11/29/december-2020-astrology-forecast/

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Note: This is a transcript of a spoken word podcast. If possible, we encourage you to listen to the audio or video version, since they include inflections that may not translate well when written out. Our transcripts are created by human transcribers, and the text may contain errors and differences from the spoken audio. If you find any errors then please send them to us by email: theastrologypodcast@gmail.com

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Transcribed by Teresa “Peri” Lardo

Transcription released March 3rd, 2026

Copyright © 2026 TheAstrologyPodcast.com

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CHRIS BRENNAN: Hi. My name is Chris Brennan, and you’re listening to The Astrology Podcast. In this episode, we’re gonna be talking about the astrological forecast for December of 2020. Joining me today are astrologers Kelly Surtees and Austin Coppock. Hey guys, how’s it going? 

AUSTIN COPPOCK: Hey. 

KELLY SURTEES: Hi! 

CB: Hey. And let’s see, so today is Friday, November 27th, 2020, starting at 11:18 AM in Denver, Colorado, and this is episode 281. 

So we’re gonna first spend the first 30 minutes kind of reviewing some of the highlights of November and some of the astrology that worked out well over the past month. Then we’re gonna jump right into the forecast for December. So if you wanna jump ahead, just look in the description below this video or on our podcast website for the timestamps for this episode, and you can jump forward 30 minutes if you wanna skip the review and just go straight to the forecast. 

But with that introduction out of the way, let’s first take a look at – I wanted to show the animation for December just to give us an idea of what the astrology looks like. So we start off the month with a lunar eclipse that takes place in Gemini technically at the very end of November, but it’s something we’re gonna be talking about here because it sort of carries through into December as one of the significant opening acts of the month. 

Eventually during the course of the month, mid-month, one of the main focal points is a solar eclipse that takes place in the sign of Sagittarius on December 14th. Shortly after that, we get Jupiter and Saturn moving into Aquarius and forming a conjunction at the very beginning of that sign. And then eventually later towards the end of the month, we get a much less impressive Full Moon in Cancer that kind of closes off December. And that is our animation for the month.

So let’s do some review first. Hey guys. How are you both doing today? 

KS: Pretty good. 

CB: It’s been a pretty quiet month, news-wise. So not much to report. 

KS: Nothing to stress out about or lose sleep over! 

CB: Right. 

AC: It’s been pretty mellow. 

CB: Pretty mellow? Thanks everybody; we’ve got an audience here – a big audience – of patrons that have joined us for the live chat. So thanks everyone for joining us. 

All right, so let’s review November and the astrology of November. Of course, the very first thing that happened in the month was the US presidential election took place on November 3rd. That coincided with Mercury stationing direct that day in Libra square Saturn, and as anticipated, that ended up coinciding with a number of major delays in learning the outcome of the election, which is basically what everybody had been predicting for a while, both astrologer and non-astrologer alike. Although the astrologers had a bit of an advantage in that we had seen this coming for a while now, for years in some instances, because of the Mercury retrograde station on election day which was similar to the station that happened 20 years ago in the year 2000, which also resulted in a delayed results election. 

Did that work out pretty much – I mean, it was pretty impressive watching it work out, wasn’t it? I mean, it was pretty standard. Were you guys surprised by any parts of that? 

AC: I would have been surprised if there was no delay, or if it only took two or three days. Right? Like, that would have been somewhat shocking. But yeah, I mean, it worked out as expected, and then wasn’t it as Mercury cleared the square with Saturn that things began to look decisive? 

CB: Yeah. What — 

KS: Yes. 

CB: — happened is there was just this agonizing several day period where, unlike most election days, it wasn’t decided that night. And Mercury stationed and it started moving forward again, but it was moving very slowly and it was applying to Saturn for three or four days. And there were these funny headlines, and I tried to save some of them just so we could talk about them on this episode. But this was one from The Washington Post; it says, “As election day drags into election week, the waiting is the hardest part.” And the subtitle says, “An anxious nation clenches its jaw and prays for the vote-counters in Pennsylvania to hurry up already.” So I thought that was really great, funny, like, evocative language for Mercury squaring Saturn and Mercury also being slow coming out of its retrograde period. 

KS: Yeah, it was so literal. I don’t know if it was you guys I was talking to or somebody else around Thursday or Friday of that week; I was like, the newscasters – you know, and we get a lot of our news from non-American sources, so Canadian news channels and even Australian news channels. But they were all, you know, focused on the US election as well. And the newscasters were literally saying, “Just be patient and stay calm.” You know, “It’s just gonna take time.” And it was almost as though they were interpreting the astrology as they’re talking to all their viewers. 

And the other thing that I thought was so kind of really literal in a very simple symbolic way was the idea that it was this very slow counting process. You know, Mercury likes to measure things. Saturn likes to make sure things are done right, you know; we’ve double checked and triple checked. And it just seemed to be this excruciatingly slow, “Let’s check; we can only count so many votes each day,” or “We have to tick this box, and it’s just gonna take time,” and it was, as you said, Austin, it was exactly as probably laborious as the astrology indicated it was going to be. But there’s something really different to be in that rather than to be anticipating that. And so to be in the thick of what that feels like is a whole ‘nother level of it. 

CB: Yeah. 

AC: Indeed. Yeah, there was a lot of clenching. 

KS: A lot of clenching! 

AC: Not only of jaws, but you know. All sorts of muscle groups. 

CB: Right. And that – yeah. So that worked out very well. So we were basically watching it then over the next few days, and it was interesting because we had a doubling up of significations. It wasn’t just Mercury squaring Saturn, but also Mercury even though it had stationed direct, one of the things that this really emphasized is that planets once they’ve stationed direct, they’re still moving slowly. There’s still like, this period where the planet is moving super slowly, and it’s like it’s coming out of a period almost of being drunk or something and being in the hangover phase coming out of that retrograde cycle. There was an astrologer, I think named Adene, on Twitter that was making an analogy like that, and I thought it was really apt in this instance. And it made me – I think that’ll be applicable to other planets as well when we talk about retrograde periods in the future. But as you said, Austin, Mercury was applying to the square with Saturn, and then eventually it perfected and completed that square on November 6th. And what was really interesting is it was just after – it was that night, because Leisa Schaim, my partner, stayed up all night just to watch what would happen when that square completed. And what ended up happening is shortly after that, some of the vote counting I believe in Pennsylvania finally caught up enough where all of the in-person voting votes were counted first, and those tended to trend for Trump because he had encouraged his supporters to vote in person and to not vote by mail, whereas most of the Democrats voted by mail, and their votes didn’t start being counted until in many instances until election day itself. So it took a long time for those to catch up. And it was right as that square perfected and started to separate that the vote counting caught up, and suddenly Biden emerged in the lead in Pennsylvania and some of the other states. And then it was only I think a day after that on November 7th that then he was projected as the winner because the vote gap got so wide that it became mathematically impossible for Trump to catch up at that point. So most of the networks started calling it for Biden at that point, and he gave I think his acceptance speech or victory speech or whatever you call it around the 7th or the 8th. Is that how you guys experienced it as well, or were you following it that closely? 

AC: Not quite that closely. 

KS: Not to the level of dedication that we should honor Leisa with – her staying up all night. But I mean, that sense of looking back, and I remember at the time thinking, yeah, Mercury’s now cleared the square to Saturn. It makes sense that it seems like the pace is picking up, or there’s more information about the numbers coming through more quickly. And of course, I think it was within 24 hours that there was calls coming in for Biden. 

CB: Yeah. So this is interesting; I mean, it worked out well in terms of the astrology, and astrologers had been saying that for a while. It became less impressive, because also from just a practical standpoint, people were anticipating that the outcome wouldn’t be known on election night, but that it might take a few days for all the votes to be counted due to the pandemic primarily. So basically, any astrologers that predicted that after March while it’s still in line with the astrology and somewhat impressive, it’s not as impressive. So in episode I think it was 278, Leisa and I went back and did a review of some of the astrology that was interesting now that we know the outcome. And one of the things I did is I put out a call for people to send in predictions that they found from astrologers from prior to March before the pandemic really took off in the US that were talking about the Mercury retrograde on election day and how that would coincide with potential delays like it did in 2000 since we know a lot of astrologers have been talking about this but not everybody issues like, year ahead forecasts. And one of the most interesting – one of the best ones that a listener named – his name was Robert Walker, I believe – yeah, Robert Walker sent in was from an astrologer named Pam Ciampi who wrote for Llewellyn’s 2020 Daily Planetary Guide, and she submitted this prediction in December of 2018 where she basically wrote weekly predictions for the entire year ahead of 2020. But because it was a print publication, she sent it in almost two years ago at this point. So this image – Paula Belluomini sent it to me, because she does our artwork for the podcast and she also contributed to this planner. But listen to this; I think I’ll read part of it because it’s actually pretty impressive. But for November 2nd through the 8th, it says – and remember this was submitted two years ago – it says, 

“This year, Tuesday, November 3rd is one of the most important days of the week, the month, and possibly the year, because it’s the US presidential election day and Mercury, which indicates communications and voting, is at a standstill station in Libra. What’s so remarkable about all of that? Well, on past election days when Mercury was stationary and getting ready to switch direction, it brought snags, glitches, and communication complications. The last time of note was on election day 2000 when Mercury stationed retrograde in the last degree of Libra. The outcome of the day resulted in the famous hanging chads and Al Gore’s loss to George W. Bush. If we fast forward to 2020, Mercury is stationing in Libra again on election day. The difference between 2000 and 2020 is that in 2000, Mercury was stationing retrograde, and in 2020, Mercury is stationing direct.” That was actually a typo, because that’s not true. It was also stationing retrograde, so it was an exact repetition. But we’ll skip that. Continuing on, it says, “November 3rd is expected to bring about technical difficulties; it will affect the voting process and possibly interfere with the entire internet. Besides this, Mercury is squaring the three outer planets that control social and economic powers. A Mercury-Pluto square suggests extreme or brutal tactics. A Mercury-Saturn square brings rigid thinking and communication difficulties that might involve the law. And a Mercury-Jupiter square is a sign of wild embellishments and errors in judgment. There’s a real possibility that this November 3rd could be another election day mess with no clear winner and accusations of fraud and cheating.” 

So I thought that was pretty impressive. I wanted to give a shout out to Pam, because sadly Pam submitted that forecast for publication in December of 20 – of two years ago, of 2018, but then she passed away from cancer just three weeks later in January of 2019. So yeah, Pam was a former president of the San Diego Astrological Society, and she was also a listener of The Astrology Podcast and somebody that commented on it in the past and also bought posters that she used for her forecasts. So I just wanted to recognize her contribution there, since it’s one of the earliest predictions that I’ve been able to find so far that kind of nailed it in terms of what ended up happening on election day. 

KS: Yeah, that’s a very impressive forecast. Like, it’s specific; it’s clear; and in hindsight, it’s very accurate. 

AC: Yeah, it’s a lot better than, as you said, post-pandemic. It’s like, ah, it’ll probably take a while. But that’s nice. You can see that she was flying on instruments very successfully there, rather than just reading what it was gonna look like. 

CB: Yeah. And I mean, especially the fact that she passed away, she would have had no knowledge of anything close to the pandemic or anything remotely related to that. It was purely based on the astrology. So related to that based on the astrology, it’s like, there’s other forecasts and other people did year ahead forecasts. We, for example, did a year ahead forecast, and I went back to listen to that to see what we said about the Mercury retrograde which would station on election day. And it was kind of funny and kind of sad, and I have to apologize to Kelly, because unfortunately at the point where I think Kelly was about to start saying something about Mercury stationing direct on election day, I interrupted in order to take us back to talk about something earlier in the retrograde cycle before we moved on, and I think I screwed up and accidentally stopped us from when one of us would have actually mentioned and talked about that. So I’m sorry about that, Kelly. My bad. 

KS: That’s okay! I think you review the tape, because I certainly don’t remember. Yeah. But it’s classic Mercury retro, right? We went to do something different instead of that. 

CB: Yeah. Well, we did talk about the Mercury square Saturn and everything else and the potential slowness of that configuration as an archetype. But it would have been better if we actually jumped into the discussion, but yeah, we got Mercury retrograded. 

All right, so that I think was the core review stuff that I wanted to review in terms of just the Mercury retrograde things. Other things that happened this month in terms of November that were relevant – is there anything else you guys wanted to say about that, or election things? 

No? 

KS: No. 

CB: Okay. 

KS: No. 

AC: I don’t think so. 

CB: That’s fine. So the other thing that happened in November was the Jupiter-Pluto conjunction and the station of Mars, which took place at around the same time around the Jupiter-Pluto was November 12th and Mars stationed direct in Aries around the 13th. 

So what we’ve seen since then, there were two things that we were kind of keeping our eye on. One of them is that we had started noticing earlier this year that the previous two waves of covid had coincided with spikes of the Jupiter-Pluto conjunction – that the last two Jupiter-Pluto conjunctions had coincided with high points in daily covid case diagnoses, especially in the US. And we were wondering if this third – and had kind of anticipated and suggested that this third conjunction might coincide with another spike in the covid case numbers. And unfortunately, that actually ended up being strikingly true, because we’re in the middle of a third major spike and major wave that’s happening in the United States right now. And our friend Kyle at ArchetypalExplorer.com, which is an astrology program, threw together this graph using his program to show us what the current covid wave looks like compared to the date of the Jupiter-Pluto conjunction. And at this point, it’s filling it out and looking pretty striking because we’re seeing this huge wave in new covid cases hitting the US right now, and it’s coinciding pretty well with that third Jupiter-Pluto conjunction that hit in the middle of November. 

What do you guys think? 

KS: I mean, it’s very scary in the sense — 

AC: Oh, I mean it’s — 

KS: Sorry, Austin! 

CB: You both seem a little — 

AC: Oh, I mean, I think — 

CB: — sleepy today. Are we – you’re still waking up or something? 

AC: No, I’m actually restraining myself so that I don’t start ranting. 

CB: Okay! 

AC: But no. I mean, I think that it’s pretty self-evident when you look at the graphs that there is a very strong parallel there. 

CB: Yeah. Well, that was an interesting thing coming out of this, because it’s like, we all – I don’t think any of us going into this, except for a handful of astrologers, are not like, scholars on virologist – we’re not virologists or something like this, so getting into and studying past pandemics and studying some of the current pandemic and trying to understand some of the cycles has been new to us, because this is, I think, the first time any of us in our adult lives are living through a major worldwide pandemic of this nature and starting to see some of the correlations like this has been really striking and really interesting. And we’ve all gotten a major crash course in mundane astrology this year when, you know, sometimes the astrology can be strikingly literal and strikingly straightforward. And I think this is one of those instances. 

AC: Yeah, absolutely. As I’ve said on earlier episodes this year, and in talking about Jupiter and Pluto and pandemic activity, I think that we can’t ignore, you know, the two biggest periods of time, both the initial run as well as the second wave, not only had Jupiter with Pluto, but also close to Saturn and also with Mars angular. So we have all of the malefics in a position to beat up very effectively on poor, helpful Jupiter. 

CB: Right. Yeah. And there’s a lot more going on, obviously, in this graph than just Jupiter-Pluto, because we’ve had the Mars-Saturn conjunction back in March. We’ve had the Mars squaring all of those planets from Aries squaring Mars and Jupiter and Pluto during the course of the retrograde. So there’s a lot of different factors in play that are resulting in this year that’s interesting just seeing this right now and how close it is in terms of those three specific waves. 

KS: Totally. It’s a little unsettling, I guess, looking at that USA graph in that the Jupiter-Pluto is an aspect that’s now starting to separate, whereas I’m not sure if that wave is descending yet for US specifically. Like, the covid number wave. 

CB: Yeah. Well, that’s one of the things – like, if you look at it, though, that’s one of the things that’s still making me a little nervous is just the Jupiter-Pluto conjunction happens, but then the peak of the actual covid cases actually is a little bit after that. It’s like the Jupiter-Pluto conjunction is always hitting the upward spike of when it’s rising, but the one in April – the peak in cases was like, it looks like a week or two after the conjunction. And then the one in the summer, the conjunction happened at the very end of June, and then the peak was delayed by a couple of weeks. It was in the middle of July or so, the second or third week of July, which means we may not quite be at the top here of this current peak in terms of the cases since the conjunction just happened in the middle of November. 

KS: Yeah, it’s quite the exponential situation on that third – like, that’s… I mean, math class was a long time ago, but that’s a big step up from the middle of the year in terms of case numbers. 

CB: Right. Yeah. 

So that was a major thing, but is an interesting little piece of astrology in review and something we’re gonna take away and having learned from this year. Another thing that I mentioned in the last forecast episode and I emphasized was I had noticed that earlier in the year that the Jupiter-Pluto conjunctions, the previous ones, had kept coinciding with explosions of conspiracy theory rhetoric and false conspiracy theories being spread around. And I kind of anticipated that this third one would be as well. And if you listen to the last forecast, I said, you know, no matter what side loses, there’s probably gonna be accusations and a lot of wild conspiracy theories being thrown around about it being – the election being – stolen or something like that. And that actually also ended up turning out to be strikingly accurate. So there was this NPR politics story on November 8th that said, it said in a tweet, it said, “Experts say that the combination of President Trump’s continued false assertions of a stolen election and rapidly growing social media groups sharing those claims has led to ‘the most intense online disinformation event in US history.’” And I thought that that was really striking and really interesting just again in terms of that Jupiter-Pluto conjunction and what the third and final hit sort of left us with or will leave us with going forward. 

AC: I think – yeah, to extend that out a little further, because I was thinking about that. In a lot of traditional texts, Jupiter is truth and the pursuit of the truth. 

CB: Right. 

AC: And as we’ve talked about, Jupiter has just been terribly abused for virtually this entire year. And if we were going to take the state of truth and see how healthy it was in terms of discussion on a general level, I don’t think truth has had a very good year. 

CB: Yeah. 

AC: Which is in part – well, it makes December’s events very exciting, because Jupiter leaves this position of being badly damaged in two and a half weeks from now. But yeah, not a good year for truth. And so I wanted to follow up on one of my Jupiter-Pluto things that I’d noted earlier on. Our first Jupiter-Pluto saw the unprecedentedly huge bailout in the United States back in the spring, and then the second conjunction saw really intense talks about it, but it didn’t happen. And so I speculated last month that maybe the third conjunction would bring another bailout. And it certainly ramped up the talks, but as of the time of this recording, there’s no bailout package. Although it’d be surprising if we went another two months without one. And it might be that the bailout gets designed now but isn’t ratified until later. But we’ll see. It was just something I noticed. 

CB: Yeah. So far, nothing is happening, and that’s causing a lot of tension because I think Congress just like, went on vacation for the holiday or something with no bailout. So a lot of people are in bad shape, and a lot of the lockdowns are going back into place in different parts of the country where the covid numbers are exploding. I know here in Denver, we’re like, one step away from the most harsh lockdowns that were happening in March. So a lot of people are in a bad place. And it’s something we talked about a lot this year, Austin, how the understanding of the economy – there’s been this split now where like, what’s happening on Wall Street, which has just recently passed 30,000 – the DOW passed 30,000 for the first time in history, which would otherwise theoretically mean that the economy is doing great. But in reality, the unemployment numbers are just skyrocketing right now at the same time. 

AC: Yeah. Well, and we talked about the United States, as I talked about a lot at the beginning of Saturn’s ingress into Capricorn, the United States always takes an economic hit, sometimes huge, sometimes moderate, during Saturn’s time in Capricorn. And so we expected that to happen. And it’s been really interesting to see that happen, right, the actual bones and mechanics of the economy are devastated. But we expect that to coincide with market numbers. Maybe not perfectly, but we expect, you know, some relationship or parallel there. And those things are, at least for the time, completely decoupled. And so it’s interesting in retrospect, because we see the clear correlation of economic activity in the United States during – and economic health in the United States during Saturn in Capricorn, that’s tied together. But apparently the market isn’t tied to Saturn’s time in Capricorn for the United States, or is no longer, or is temporarily decoupled. 

CB: Yeah. I think that’s gotta be some sort of lesson about Capricorn and just the pileup of Capricorn in the past few years. I went downtown a couple nights ago to pick up some food from the Mercury Cafe, which I talked about in the past, which we have the birth chart for. It has like, Scorpio rising, and Capricorn is its 3rd house of your neighborhood and your neighbors. And this was the first time I had been down there since February, because after the pandemic broke out we stopped being able to host our local astrology meetings there in person. And I was really struck by how the entire neighborhood had changed radically, and these big, these huge buildings had been completed. The construction had been completed of like, these very nice condo buildings all around it, because it used to be on the outskirts of Denver in the middle of nowhere in kind of a crummy part of town. But now all of a sudden, there’s all these nice fancy condo buildings around it, but then there’s also just a couple blocks over like, a village of tents and stuff that have been set up by homeless people and people that are not doing very well. So there’s this huge disparity in – economically speaking – that’s almost visible in some parts of the country right now, and I wonder if some of that doesn’t get worse if some of those trends continue. 

AC: Yeah. I don’t wanna take this tangent too far, but I will just say that, you know, even though Saturn and Jupiter are moving along out of Capricorn this very month, Pluto will remain in that last decan of Capricorn. And that is the place that Pluto was when the United States happened. And you know, if we use the language that people often do with Pluto that’s it like, it’s an entity or a person’s shadow, the issues that they can’t see very well or talk about very well – I’ve for a long time thought that that Pluto in Capricorn in the US chart was like a concealed Plutonian hidden class problem. And certainly nothing makes class clearer than the beautiful, newly built luxury condos next to a growing tent city. 

CB: Yeah. 

AC: And so that runs until 2025-ish, that Pluto return, at least within a few degrees. 

CB: Right. Okay. So I think those are the main things I wanted to review in terms of the astrology of November. Are there any other points that we should touch on? Anything else that stood out to you guys? Kelly, did you notice anything interesting in November? 

KS: I mean, the one thing that I noticed here, because I’m in Europe, obviously, and we went into our kind of current lockdown right around the start of November. So just leading into that first Jupiter-Pluto conjunction – or sorry, not the first, the third, sorry. That final one on the 12th. And the numbers in Europe had really been building as we led into that. So Europe’s graph is not exactly the same as the US graph, but there is, I guess, somewhat of a correlation of having another wave with that Jupiter-Pluto conjunction. So that’s been really interesting. Because in Belgium, we’ve been in lockdown and France and Germany and I think even the UK now are all in varying stages of lockdown and that more extreme containment. I mean, one of the symbolic things that I think about with lockdown is sort of a government power having an extreme influence on the citizens or the people within its borders. And so that’s been interesting. I know different countries around the world – Australia’s doing something totally different. Australia’s experience with covid wouldn’t probably match the Jupiter-Pluto conjunctions so tidily, for instance. 

CB: Well, that’s related to what you’re saying, though, because that’s partially – didn’t like, Melbourne and the area do extreme lockdowns, and that’s part of the reason they were able to get it under control? 

KS: Yeah. So Melbourne, which is the capital of a state named Victoria in the southern part of Australia, they got really hit with the second hit, the late June hit, and they went into a very extreme, 11-week lockdown. And Australia – I mean, one thing Australia has that’s unique is that because it’s an island country, one thing Australia did fairly early in the process is they can lock their country border down – like, the international border – and they’ve had very extreme quarantine requirements for anyone entering the country. So the regulations have applied in slightly different ways, but you know, many people on the eastern side of Australia, which is where the majority of the population are – Queensland and New South Wales – have had very little lockdown restrictions relative to other parts of Australia and relative to other parts of the world. 

CB: Okay. 

KS: Yeah. So it’s been interesting to watch. But certainly in Europe, the Jupiter-Pluto has been, yeah. Another lockdown here. 

CB: Got it. Yeah. So we’ve learned a lot about that. We’ve learned about Pluto and Pluto’s important. I think that’s one of the things we learned this year, first with the Saturn-Pluto conjunction in January when covid really first got started and came onto the world scene and became known, and then the lockdowns over the subsequent months, and then the Jupiter-Pluto conjunctions this year. 

So I think that’s it. That’s probably good for reviewing the astrology of November, and we’ve kept it to a pretty solid 30 minutes. Are you guys ready to get into the astrology of December? 

KS: Yes. 

AC: Indeed. 

CB: All right. 

KS: I’m ready to be in it! 

CB: You’re ready to move on into December and — 

KS: Yes. 

CB: — get to the last, the end game of 2020? 

All right, so here – let me share the calendar for December where we can see… See if I can back up. Here’s November, because we actually need to mention – see, there’s this lunar eclipse that’s happening in Gemini on the 30th of November. So we wanted to mention that, because that really does carry us into the first part of December. 

On December 1st, Mercury ingresses into Sagittarius. Then things are kind of slow for about a week before eventually on the 14th of December, we get one of the highlights of the month, which is a solar eclipse which is happening in the sign of Sagittarius. The day after that on December 15th, Venus goes into Sagittarius as well. Then Saturn on December 17th finally completes its three-year trip through the sign of Capricorn, and it moves for the final time into Aquarius where it’s gonna stay for the next couple of years. Then on the 19th of December, Jupiter moves into Aquarius, and the same day, we get a Sun-Mercury conjunction. Mercury moves into Capricorn on the 19th. Then on the winter solstice, when the Sun moves into Capricorn, we get the much anticipated Jupiter-Saturn conjunction in the first degree of Aquarius on December 21st. Then the only other major thing that happens in the month is a Full Moon in Cancer on the 29th of December. 

So that is the overview. Do you guys wanna hit this in terms of most important stuff first, or shall we go through this chronologically and build up to the middle of the month where everything is? 

AC: I have a strong preference for starting with the eclipses and treating them as a pair, and then kind of moving on to the rest of it. Y’all okay with that? 

CB: That sounds like a plan. 

KS: That sounds good. 

CB: All right. So let’s start then with our first eclipse, which is that lunar eclipse that’s gonna take place on the very last day of November. 

Let’s see, so here’s the chart of the moment. Let’s bring it to the end of November. There we go! So it looks like we’re talking about a lunar eclipse at eight degrees of Gemini, which is gonna happen very early on the 30th. All right, so — 

AC: Yeah, so – go ahead. 

CB: I was just gonna mention, we see our nodal axis has moved and shifted firmly into Gemini and Sagittarius at this point. So this is one of the consequences of that nodal shift that first happened way back in the late spring or early summer. 

AC: Yeah. And that’s actually what I first wanted to talk about is it was actually middle of May, I believe, is when the mean nodes shifted. And then when it became eclipse season in June, we had kind of a little bit of eclipse action on that axis, but it wasn’t proper. This very end of November and first half of December is the first time we’re really going to get to see what the North Node in Gemini and South Node in Sagittarius eclipses look like. Right? This is a proper installment with a full eclipse on both sides. And so in a sense, this is the first full introduction to this cycle, whereas we had, you know, the shadow of an eclipse or the shadow of a shadow of what this might look like about six months ago. But this is our proper introduction. 

CB: Yeah. So we’re now fully into this eclipse cycle at this point, and I think I actually have another beautiful little graphic to share from Kyle at Archetypal Explorer who excels in his program with these sorts of things. So there we can see the line-up. Because eclipses happen when the path of the Sun and Moon intersects and when they get really close so that the body of the Moon actually moves across the face of the Sun. But during most other parts of the year when we have Full Moons and New Moons, they don’t cross each other in that exact way. But that’s what’s so unique about this solar and lunar eclipse that’s happening here is them actually crossing each other. So here’s that nice little visualization of that. 

So what are some of our keywords for a lunar eclipse? What keywords do you use for lunar eclipses, just in general, Kelly? 

KS: Lunar eclipses, part of the way I interpret them depends on whether it’s a lunar eclipse or Full Moon near the South Node or the North Node, because I’ll tend to weave in the particular piece of the nodal axis. But generally speaking, a lot of emotional agitation; I like the word “agitation” for eclipses. The things being stirred up or disrupted. Another word or sort of idea that I like for eclipses, not necessarily specific to lunar eclipses but to eclipses in general, is the idea of a regular pattern being disrupted or interrupted. Because as you were just saying and showing with that diagram, we have a New and a Full Moon every month. Every couple of weeks, the Sun and the Moon are doing something or another. But it’s only every six weeks or so when the plane of the earth and the Moon and the Sun kind of come into a particular type of alignment that we get either the earth between the Sun and Moon or we get the Moon between the Sun and the earth. So that idea of a regular thing being temporarily disrupted. And one of the other pieces that I often think about with eclipses is normally, it’s a Full Moon. Normally we see the light of the Moon, or normally it’s a New Moon and we can see the Sun, for instance. So the idea of playing around with concepts of light, of what can you normally see, and then what do you have to see in the darkness? Or what kind of senses do you have to call on to see when you can’t use your eyes, for instance. And so that idea of subtle knowing or internal inner space becomes very important for me under both lunar and solar eclipses. So there’s a few themes that I always play around with with these eclipses. 

CB: Nice. That makes sense. 

AC: Yeah, I like that a lot. One type of imagery I found myself using a lot when I was writing about eclipses was black lights or bioluminescent creatures where you can’t see them when it’s bright out, right? Where you only see the black light when the normal light goes out, right? Or like, the —

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — like, the way, way, way, way deep undersea creatures. Like the little sparkly shrimp and luminescent monster fish and all that. I suppose we could add some of the like, crime scene stuff to that if we’d like to get morbid, which I might. We’ll see. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: That would be out of character. 

KS: But it – that would be very consistent. But it is true; it’s that idea of when the main light goes out, what can you now see? So it’s that idea of playing around with sight and darkness and a lack of light. You can really spend a lot of time exploring that as a concept. 

CB: Yeah. And one of the things, you know, as a basic New Moon/Full Moon thing that we always talk about is the idea of something beginning at the New Moon and sort of culminating or reaching a sense of completion or fullness at the Full Moon because the Moon is at its darkest at the New Moon and then it becomes increasing in light and getting brighter and brighter and brighter until eventually it hits the Full Moon when it gets at the opposition point from the Sun, which is both a peak in the sense of full maturity, but it’s also the point at which there starts to be a decrease in the Moon’s light at that point, so it starts to lose something past that point. So there’s a state of it being at its height or at the peak of its power and brightness and ability to illuminate things at the Full Moon, which is just emphasized and accentuated by it also being an eclipse. So for many people, it’s gonna be accentuating and illuminating some part of the life in a particular way that’s gonna stand out more than a typical Full Moon in indicating or opening up a six-month period of things culminating and being brought to completion in that area of your life wherever it falls.

KS: One of the things I had thought about specifically for this lunar eclipse, because it’s in Gemini on the North Node, was that idea of hunger, of wanting more information or more knowledge or just feeling like, “I can’t get enough, and I need more,” and that being something to do with communication or connection or conversation or ideas and information. And that potentially leading to a little bit of mental overwhelm, perhaps, if we get some of that extreme sort of unbalanced energy that we can get with eclipses. 

AC: Yeah, it’s definitely a bit much, and I would add that – so this lunar eclipse will be visible throughout both of the Americas and Australia and sort of the eastern-ish half of the Asian continent. So this one will be visible to a lot of people. And one thing that we’ve mentioned before that I think we would be remiss not to mention again is that this lunar eclipse happens very close to one of the royal stars, which is Aldebaran. And so this will be interesting visually, because Aldebaran is a very red star and very bright and very close to the ecliptic. And lunar eclipses, especially a penumbral one like this, you know, the Moon takes on a reddish cast. It’s not that it disappears from the sky, right, but it’s darkened and sort of stained or bloodied. And so we’ll have like, a very reddened Moon right next to a very red star. And one of the things that we’d speculated about as far back as the forecast last year was that, okay, that royal stars such as Aldebaran often describe what big, powerful people are doing – people who would be the modern-day equivalent of royalty. And Aldebaran in particular tends to, in my experience, is that it tends to signify people who have a high rank because they own lots of things. And so it’ll be interesting to see what one, all the royal stars I would say testify to leadership and describe people in high positions, and Aldebaran in particular into people who are in high positions because they own lots of things. And so we would expect some of the eclipse to play out over the following weeks in terms of noticeable events with people who own lots of things. 

CB: Yeah. And I was thinking about, it’s like, prior to the election, one of the things we were talking about also were how the eclipses were hitting the different candidates’ charts and that both Trump and Pence are Geminis; they both have their Sun in Gemini. We know that that’s Trump’s ruler of the Ascendant; we don’t have Pence’s birth time, so we don’t know his houses. But the way it’s turning out is the idea of culmination but also completion and wrapping something up or something ending and starting to wind down sometimes happens when a Full Moon and a lunar eclipse hits a important part of your chart. So for them, it’s like, sort of ending a major phase of their lives, evidently, in terms of leaving office and moving away from that period of power. 

AC: Well, yeah, it’s a – one of the things we discussed, right, is that literally every candidate had this set of eclipses that we’re talking about right now nailing their chart. Right? Everybody was getting hit. Kamala and Biden both had a first-7th hit from this pair of eclipses. Trump was literally born on an eclipse with the Sun in Gemini and Moon in Sagittarius, so same place. And then Pence has it on the Sun, right? And so the eclipse is just – they get things moving. Right? 

One sort of general eclipse thing that we can say is that things move quicker during the period between eclipses, the normal. It’s a little, yeah. And I think that’s true for all those people. Right? It’s gonna be a big two weeks. Things are gonna move. 

KS: A lot of – so and when you’re saying that period between eclipses, Austin, you’re referring to the November 30th to December 14 – the window between the two eclipse portals, almost. 

AC: Yeah. Absolutely. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: The ol’ bardo. 

CB: Yeah. So that’s a really good point. And it’s also a good point that Trump was born on an eclipse, but it was the reverse of the current one because Trump was born on a Sagittarius lunar eclipse, and this is gonna be a Gemini lunar eclipse in the later part of Gemini. So it’s almost the exact opposite even though it’s the same interesting sort of signature. But I would expect, or my expectation is for that two-week period to be sort of like, a winding down and completion phase for him, because we’re still in a weird phase where he hasn’t conceded at this point. Like most of the votes have been certified in the different states that Biden has won in the different swing states, which means on December 14th, presumably, when all of the electoral college votes, that’s when it’s gonna be finally certified for the final time. And then of course, as we’ve commented on in previous forecasts, is gonna fall exactly on our second eclipse, which is gonna be that solar eclipse in Sagittarius on December 14th that falls in what just happens to be Biden’s rising sign. And that was one of the more compelling things that was working in his favor, you know, prior to the election in the pre-election analysis was just in the past several elections, whoever had the solar eclipse falling in their rising sign or their 10th whole sign house tended to be the guy that won, which was Obama’s two victories in 2008 and 2012, but also Trump and the eclipse cycle starting in Leo and Aquarius around the time that he was elected in 2016, 2017. 

So shall we move onto the second eclipse, the December eclipse, then? Since it’s a nice segue? 

AC: Yeah. 

KS: Yes. And you know, when I was thinking about this month in preparation for our show today, I thought, you know, December is really a pivotal month. There are three things that are going on that if just that thing was happening alone, it would be a big month. Like — 

CB: Right. 

KS: — Jupiter changing signs would be, we’d spend almost, you know, a lot of time talking about that if that was happening. If Saturn was changing signs, we’d be spending time on that. And if there was a total solar eclipse, we’d also spend time on that. And this month brings, you know, all three. And it is quite a strong eclipse; it’s 23 Sag. It’s Kamala Harris’s Descendant. It’s Trump’s Moon-South Node. Like, it’s a big eclipse in the sky for all of us to navigate in our personal lives, and then to continue the thread that you were both talking about with the political links. It’s making some very strong, you know, degree-based activations in the charts of people whose lives are potentially gonna be moving faster in this timeframe. 

CB: Yeah. So it’s looking like it’s gonna be 23 degrees of Sagittarius is the exact degree of the eclipse. 23 Sagittarius. And I thought this was really, let me pull this up – really interesting. Because I haven’t seen this commented on a lot, but now it’s fascinating. So it’s not just that Biden has Sagittarius rising, so that that eclipse is gonna fall exactly in his rising sign exactly on the day that happens to be when the electoral college will meet. But you know, Austin, you and I have been talking a lot about the US Sibley chart this year, which has Sagittarius rising and the ruler of the Ascendant in Cancer. And interestingly, it’s like, the US just elected a president who has Sagittarius rising and the ruler of the Ascendant is Jupiter in Cancer. Has anybody commented on that? I think that’s kind of a striking little similarity. 

AC: Oh, right. Same Ascendant and ruler. Well, the US loves to elect people with benefics in Cancer, right? It’s that sort of comforting American story. It’s something we’ve done over and over and over again.

KS: Yeah, it’s a striking signature. I’ve noticed that in another politician who’s gained some attention in the last couple of years, which is Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is also a Sag rising with Jupiter in Cancer chart. 

AC: Oh! That’s interesting. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: But yeah, Obama had – probably still does – have Venus in Cancer — 

KS: Venus in Cancer.

AC: George Bush Junior was a Cancer with some other stuff. You know, I guess even Trump has Venus in Cancer. Americans love to vote for people with planets in Cancer, which makes sense considering that the US has four planets in Cancer in that Sibley chart. But that same rising and ruler is very interesting. 

CB: Yeah. And it’s that weird degree that was getting hit all this fall. It’s not just in Cancer, but it’s like, Biden’s Jupiter’s at 25 Cancer, and Trump’s Venus is at 25 Cancer, and that was the profected lord of the year this year, which ended up being really important and really decisive because then a lot of the really hard Mars-Saturn transits that were happening when that Mars-Saturn square went exact were happening around that degree around like, 25 Cancer. 

AC: Yeah. So Kelly, let’s just say that you’re not a prominent American politician. What would you expect around this solar eclipse in Sagittarius? 

KS: In Sag. So I do think it has a theme of something to do with an ending or a closure or a completion, and that’s partly to do with the eclipse being very tightly configured to the South Node, which is a natural kind of emptying out perhaps or releasing piece. I also think the idea of like, the ending component – when I was reflecting on the chart of the South Node in Sag, the eclipse on the South Node in Sag, the eclipse ruler is Jupiter, which is at 28, 29 degrees of Capricorn at that particular point in time. So there was this – the little phrase that I came up for this was the idea that being at the end of a long and weary journey and almost being done, but having one or two loose ends to finish up. And yeah, that’s sort of what I’m working with at the moment, yeah. So that’s kind of where I would be going, and you know, for our listeners, have a look and see the Sagittarius house in your chart, and think about, is there something that maybe you wanna end or you need to change perspective about? Are you at the end of a long and weary road about something perhaps? But you guys might have a different take, but there’s some of the ideas that I’m working with for this eclipse. 

CB: Yeah. Because the — 

AC: Yeah, let me – go ahead. 

CB: The eclipse is an ending of a cycle, because the Moon is decreasing in light from the Full Moon and then getting fainter and fainter and fainter until it disappears and becomes dark. So there’s this feeling of ending and of letting things go and the end of one cycle, but then also immediately after that it starts increasing in light, so there’s also this feeling of beginning or laying the seeds and the foundations for a new cycle, even if you’re sort of wrapping something up at that time. 

KS: Yeah, I often think there’s a contradiction when we get a New Moon on the South Node – like a New Moon eclipse on the South Node. I always sort of feel there’s this tension between is it more important that I start something or that I stop something? Or do I have to do the stopping so that I can do the starting kind of thing. 

AC: Yeah, I would go with the latter. The South Node and the New Moons in general are both about clearing out and emptying. But I really – my mind really wants to notice that this is the first proper solar eclipse in this year-and-a-half —

KS: True. 

AC: — long series. And that there’s an emptying out, but it’s an emptying out so that we can do a whole ‘nother year-plus of story. And so the action in the moment probably is going to look like ending or emptying, but it’s an ending or an emptying that sets the stage for another two full sets of eclipses. 

CB: Right. 

KS: Yeah, it’s like an ending with a purpose almost. Like, we have to do this so that we can do what’s coming. 

AC: Or like an emptying that begins a story. Like a story that begins with a disappearance, right? Like a lot of mysteries begin —

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — with a disappearance, where there’s something that’s supposed to be there and then it disappears, right? Or someone that’s supposed to be there. And so the mystery begins. 

CB: And that’s a good point, though, that it’s the first real set of eclipses in this axis so that it’s opening up a chapter that’s gonna last for a year or so of eclipses bouncing back and forth between these two signs of Gemini and Sagittarius and therefore sort of opening up a wormhole or opening up a portal where all sorts of stuff is gonna start sort of flooding into that part of a person’s life in terms of changes and major endings but also major beginnings on whatever that axis is, especially the houses that it falls in your chart. 

KS: Yeah. And one other collective topic that I wonder about is travel, international travel and air travel. And thinking back to the nodes, the last time the South Node was in Sag was in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 – you know, so late 2001 and 2002 – where air travel looked very different, you know, with new security measures coming in and extra documentation and things like that required. I’m intrigued as to whether this eclipse on the South Node in Sag brings some sort of development to do with what international travel looks like in a post-pandemic or a post-covid world. You know, I don’t necessarily have a speculation about exactly what that might be, but I just wonder whether some of the plans that airlines or governments or countries might have regarding travel could be discussed or coming up or part of the conversation around that eclipse in Sag. 

CB: Yeah. Well, I mean, one of the things that’s happening is that supposedly we’re starting to hear reports that some of the first waves of vaccines are gonna start being rolled out as soon as mid-December. I just saw a report saying that, so that in and of itself could perhaps help in terms of the travel industry being in really bad shape at this point and just being like, a fraction of the people that would normally be flying are flying right now. So perhaps travel’s starting to be able to have a chance to open up as that slowly starts easing again. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: So – right, and so there’s a lot of talk about vaccines beginning to possibly land, et cetera, et cetera. Do either of you connect that to any of the semi-momentous astrological movement this month? Right, because we haven’t gotten to it, but we have basically three big ones. We have the Jupiter, the Saturn, and the initiation of this set of eclipses. Do you have like, a clear connection between the possibility of vaccines and/or the stated delivery of vaccines and any of these factors? 

CB: Yeah. I mean, if you go back and listen to our first forecast that we did for April, we did it back in March and this was our first forecast when we were back after covid that fully broken out and the entire US and the entire world had gone into lockdowns by that point, and even I’d gotten sick and was sick when we recorded that episode. But one of the things that we were focused on is how much a lot of the worldwide lockdowns seemed to be tied into at the time the Mars-Saturn conjunction that was going exact at zero degrees of Aquarius or the first degrees of Aquarius. And one of the speculations that I made was I noticed how that same degree of Aquarius is where the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction would take place in mid-December on December 21st. So I said that I was hoping that at the very end of the year, that since that was a more positive conjunction where it’s like, the first one was Mars and Saturn, the two traditional malefics, coming together and everything being really tough and really difficult as a result of the pandemic at the beginning of the year, that hopefully Jupiter joining up with Saturn at the very same degree at the end of the year would indicate some sort of alleviation or maybe the development and release of a vaccine by that time. So far, I think that’s actually working out pretty well. And there was like, a story in the Washington Post just the other day that said “First 6.4 million doses of Pfizer’s coronavirus vaccine could get out in mid-December.” And it says “more doses will be available each week, as manufacturing ramps up, even as state and local officials complain that they don’t have the funds needed to do mass vaccinations.” 

AC: Yeah. So that’s — 

CB: So — 

AC: — a really good call in retrospect. Right? Saturn conjunct a malefic – problem gets worse, signifies the real initiation of it at its full scale, and then Saturn conjunct a slow-moving benefic – potential help or solve or benefic to at least try to counter the malefic. 

CB: Yeah, exactly. That’s like, a really good lesson we can take from that in terms of the astrology and tying together events and how events get tied together when certain degrees are getting activated. And once you’ve identified a degree that is sensitive to something that’s coinciding with something, sometimes you can project that out when you see that degree coming up in the future again. 

KS: Yeah. I think, I mean, I agree completely, Chris. It was so interesting to see that Mars-Saturn, then the Jupiter-Saturn and it’s natural to think, well, whatever’s bad in April is gonna be somewhat improved or helped in December. And I also think generally the change of sign of Jupiter as well, the change in condition of Jupiter. I think a lot about, you know, Ficini’s commentary about the three graces – the Sun and Venus and Jupiter – and how these are planets that can contribute to health and vitality in general. And to go back to your comment earlier, Austin, about how we think about the state of truth in 2020 given the technical condition of Jupiter in the sky, I also think generally about the state of maybe health or vitality given the condition of Jupiter. And so it does seem to follow symbolically that not that, you know, a vaccine is necessarily the be-all and the end-all, but there is a step towards something that looks positive or is generally welcomed as a good thing. And then I also think Jupiter’s still gonna be copresent with Saturn for the time that it’s in Aquarius, so I think it’s an improvement; it’s not in fall anymore. But it’s not quite as fully functioning as we know Jupiter has the potential to be, and that makes me think in the context of the vaccine, it makes me think about the difference between having a vaccine and being able to deliver or get it to where it needs to go, because there’s sort of two steps in that process from what I understand. 

CB: Yeah. And it’s gonna be like, rolled out to healthcare workers and people like that first. So there’s gonna be like, a long gap and period before it’s available to everybody that necessarily even wants to or has the means to obtain it. 

So that could be another part of the whole eclipse thing that we’re talking about where eclipses open up these six month windows of time is having the eclipses falling in December and opening up this period where that starts to be available, but maybe that’s another thing where there’s another six month gap perhaps before it’s more widely available or as widely available as it could be. 

AC: It’s interesting. And you know, I’m just looking at this now, that eclipse – that solar eclipse towards the end of Sag – is very close to Ras Alhague, which is a fixed star – the brightest fixed star in the constellation associated with Asclepius, the divine doctor. And so that’s actually an interesting – just noticing that. So yeah. There’s a little something there. 

KS: Well — 

AC: So we’re kind of – go ahead. 

KS: I was just gonna say that makes me think one thing that I think about the South Node that can sometimes be a little bit positive is the idea of dispersing things or releasing things. And you know, in the context of a vaccine, in theory, health practitioners would talk about wanting it to be released and passed around. So just that link of what you were saying, the doctor star there, Austin, and then that South Node piece. It’s interesting timing. 

AC: Yeah. I don’t know whether an eclipse there is just an exclamation point, or it speaks to trouble. Because eclipses often speak to trouble. They always underline and you know, but they often shadow or something is obscure or there’s an issue of some sort. But at the very least, it’s certainly like, you know, a circle, an exclamation point, for doing like, the sportscasting. They like, circle and anyway. 

CB: So that’s the eclipse which is happening on December 14th. Should we talk about some of the other astrology besides that in terms of what’s happening later this week? It seems like everything – I don’t know if we need to back up at all and talk about some of the little like, minor astrology that happens in the first week in terms of Mercury changing signs or Venus changing signs, or if we just move into the bigger heavy-hitter stuff that’s happening later in the month. 

AC: Well, let’s just talk about that super quick, right? So at the beginning of the month, Mercury moves into Sag, right, when Mercury – that’s significant not only because it’s a sign ingress, but because of the retrograde cycle, Mercury has been either in Libra or Scorpio for months and months and months. So this —

CB: Right. 

AC: — is fresh terrain, fresh mode of being for Mercury. Mercury in Sag tends to move things much more quickly than Mercury in either of the other signs. And then Venus follows suit on the… 

KS: 15th. 

AC: On the 15th! And then once we get to the eclipse on the 14th, we have like, eight million things changing signs. The week of the 14th through the 21st is just chock full, not only of eclipse, Jupiter and Saturn, but we get a bunch of other ingresses. So it’s a really transition-y week, probably a better adjective for that. 

CB: Yeah. That’s such a great point. So we’re finally moving into new territory, and maybe that’s a really good keyword or good phrase for this month – moving into new territory. Because it’s not just, it’s like, Mercury does that, which has been just stuck in those two signs of Scorpio and Libra for a few months now basically due to the retrograde of Mercury. So right at the top of the month, we get that shift of Mercury moving into Sagittarius and making treading new ground, and then later in the month we get Venus also ingressing into Sagittarius on the 15th and also treading new ground in some sense, even though it didn’t go retrograde there. But then right after that, we get Jupiter and Saturn both moving into a new sign and completing what for Saturn has been a three year trek through Capricorn since December of 2017, and for Jupiter has been a year-long trek through Capricorn for – since December of last year. Is that when it shifted? 

AC: Yeah, like, early December. 

KS: Early December. Yeah. 

CB: Yeah. 

AC: December 3rd? 6th? 1st? Something like that – first week. 

CB: So it’s like, with Saturn, we get a little bit of a preview of what this ingress is about and what Saturn in Aquarius is gonna be like for the next three years earlier this year between I believe March and June when Saturn dipped into the first couple of degrees of Aquarius and then retrograded out. So you should have gotten or each individual should have gotten a little preview of what this is like. But Jupiter joining Saturn almost simultaneously at the same time brings in a new element that’s a little bit more optimistic and a little bit more balanced perhaps than just Saturn and Mars when they were there earlier in the year. 

AC: Yeah, that was — 

CB: Do you guys agree that that’s something a little bit more optimistic compared to the Mars-Saturn conjunction of like, March through June? 

AC: We got the harshest possible introduction to Saturn in Aquarius, because we had Saturn in Aquarius with Mars most of the time. Right? 

CB: Right. 

AC: And so the themes are there, but that was a rougher, hotter, more contentious version of what we’re gonna do. 

CB: Yeah. So this is gonna be a little bit smoother and a little bit lighter of an introduction hopefully, but still momentous and still very unique and important, because that conjunction between Jupiter and Saturn which only happens every 20 years is gonna happen so soon after the ingress taking place on December 21st. So a Saturn-Jupiter conjunction which hasn’t happened for 20 years happening at this time at zero degrees of Aquarius. 

KS: Yeah. And it’s gonna be, I mean, we did have a very rough introduction to Saturn in Aquarius as a cycle. This is different. And it’s also – I mean, one thing Jupiter can do that Mars doesn’t do is Jupiter can help to sort of stabilize or somehow shore up things to a certain extent. And we’re all going to have Saturn and Jupiter together in Aquarius for a full 12 months. I mean, there’s a couple of months where Jupiter goes into Pisces, but when you look at the landscape of 2021, this is kind of setting the tone. I know we’re gonna do our year ahead show separately, but this is what we’re gonna be working with, and it’s been nearly 30 years since we’ve all had Saturn in Aquarius, although we would have had Jupiter here just 12 years ago. And so it’s gonna be interesting for each of us to think about how we’re doing the kind of consolidation or reality check version of Saturn in Aquarius about whatever topics the Aquarius part of our life is, while at the same time trying to do some of the learning or developing that can come with Jupiter in Aquarius. How are you kind of holding space for both of those, Austin, when you’re looking at this or thinking about it for clients? 

AC: Well, I think I guess part of the way that I’m thinking about it is that it’s still Saturn’s domain. And so in both Capricorn and Aquarius, Jupiter can help Saturn, but Saturn doesn’t necessarily wanna help Jupiter. Right? Jupiter can help — 

KS: Of course. 

AC: — doing Saturn be more constructive, but it’s still primarily Saturn. And I’ve really been thinking a lot about the like, past-facing and future-facing qualities of Capricorn and Aquarius being the two Saturn signs, and that like, you know, in reviewing times in the 20th century when Saturn went from Capricorn to Aquarius, you can very much see a dealing with the old, seeing what will endure, what is crumbling and cannot endure, and then moving into Aquarius and starting to see the structure or the outlines of some of the future. And I’ve been thinking a lot about the future being Saturn-ruled. Not as some sort of dire prognostication about right now, but that is to a certain degree what those two signs being adjacent to each other always means. Right? And when we think of Saturn, we think of things being fixed to some degree and ruled by laws, whether laws of nature or human beings, and that they’re hard to change. And it’s very normal to think of the past as fixed, but what Saturn in Aquarius I think kind of points out to us is that the future is also subject to many of those same laws, even if they’re just simple laws of physics that cause the – you know, that guarantee that the Sun will rise again at almost exactly a time that we can calculate. And that there is a future forward. There is a gazing into the future with Aquarius and Saturn in Aquarius, but it’s not an infinite fan of possibilities. It’s given all of the things that must be, what can happen, and of those things that can happen, which do we choose? Has been sort of something that’s been going around in my head a lot lately. 

KS: Love it. Yeah, I’ve also been thinking about that orientation of like, Capricorn, past, old, tradition, preserve, protect, and Aquarius as looking forward, what can we – what’s possible and then what can we actually do? And I think that’s kind of we may be coming at it slightly differently, Austin, but ending up in the same place of not everything can happen and not everything is possible at — 

AC: Right. 

KS: — this given moment in time. But there are certain things that can be done, so let’s sort of put our weight behind those. And that sort of seems like the reorientation of Saturn coming into Aquarius, I guess. 

AC: Yeah. There’s a little bit of, like, the rules, right? Whether it’s collectively agreed upon rules or personal rules for life, it’s like, when we’re looking at Capricorn – this is what the rules have been. How do I feel about those? You know, et cetera, et cetera. Well, if you don’t like those, what would you like the rules to be? Right? For yourself, for your life, et cetera, et cetera, or on a larger and collective scale? Like, you know, what rules would work? Right? And that’s a big question, because it’s – even though Aquarius is experimental in a sense, it’s still Saturnian. It’s experimenting with rules and protocols. 

CB: Yeah. So we’re not just moving forward, but also we’re finally wrapping up the Capricorn piece. And if you noticed, it’s been interesting seeing a lot of the people with Saturn in Capricorn natally finishing up this huge three year chapter of their life and sometimes looking back and reviewing it or reflecting on what they learned from this period and what they’ve gone through. There were two prominent Aquarius rising celebrities that both have Saturn in Capricorn that I noticed both publish memoirs in the past couple of weeks. One of them was Obama, who has Aquarius rising and Saturn in Capricorn, and he posted or he published a memoir about his first four year term in office that was like, a very – not like, an expose, but very honest or at least straightforward sort of accounting of his experience of everything in that first four years. And I thought that was an interesting reflecting thing. But also interesting in terms of his Saturn in Capricorn transit, which is Saturn through his 12th house, started off pretty rough, if you remember, in 2017 because that was basically Trump’s first year in office. And then it was the entirety of Trump’s presidency ended up being Saturn in Capricorn. So a lot of that ended up being Trump kind of systematically dismantling most of the – a lot of the – things that Obama had put in place during the course of his presidency, especially anything that was based on an executive order. And I thought that was an interesting manifestation of like, Saturn transiting through the 12th house, kind of harkening back to that discussion that we a year ago in the houses episode about sometimes the 12th house having to do with, you know, one’s “enemies” or one’s detractors in some sense. 

AC: Undoing the work of the native. 

CB: Yeah, exactly. Because sometimes the 12th can be like, self-undoing, but other times it can be undoing that happens as a result of those who are working at cross-purposes to you, which sometimes in a traditional or very literal context is like, your enemies. 

AC: Who was the other person who published a biography who was a late Saturn in Cap? 

CB: So the other person was Michael J. Fox, who — 

AC: Oh! 

CB: — famously I’d used and Leisa had used as an example, because during his first Saturn return when he was 29 years old, he was diagnosed with Parkinson’s disease. And he has also Aquarius rising with Saturn in Capricorn in the 12th house, and the 12th house can also be a place of ailments and illness and suffering. And he developed Parkinson’s and had it diagnosed when he was having his first Saturn return. Now during his second Saturn return, the headline was that he published this memoir that was looking back but also announcing that he was gonna make a second retirement from acting because his health is going into a major decline again right now. And that was basically what happened during his first Saturn return was he was a very prominent actor who did like, the Back to the Future movies and everything else in the 1980s, but then he hit his Saturn return and was diagnosed with Parkinson’s and kind of had to move away from acting for a bit. But over the course of that Saturn cycle, he eventually was able to come back to acting for a period of time and become successful in doing that again. But now he’s having to go through a similar sort of repeat of having to leave again now that his health is not doing well. 

KS: It’s very sad. 

CB: Yeah. So that’s the other side of the sometimes the Saturn transit is can be difficulties, depending on what house it’s falling in. 

So that’s Michael J. Fox. And then here’s Obama’s chart, which is very similar with Aquarius rising and Saturn at 25 degrees of Capricorn. And this is like, another one of those things where I keep wondering – because Obama’s Sun is at 12 degrees of Leo, and his Descendant is at 18. So the Sun’s only like, four degrees below the Descendant, and I kept thinking that he might actually still be a day chart, and this might be another argument in favor of this being a day chart because we have an example of like, Michael J. Fox and him having that placement and the extreme sort of health issues that he struggled with versus Obama’s thing of having his agenda and legislative or other accomplishments in office sort of torn apart over the past several years. But in the end, it’s like, he has his exact Saturn return and now evidently his former vice president has just won the presidency and is presumably going to restore some of those things during the next four years, although we’ll see what happens. 

Yeah. 

AC: Interesting. 

CB: Anyway, I wanted to mention that just because I’ve been talking a lot about the Saturn in Capricorn people. I did put out a call for stories; I didn’t get as many as I had hoped, although I’m still hoping to do an episode on just talking about Saturn return stories of people that had Saturn in Capricorn over the past three years and just what different people learned from that, and this is just sort of a preview of that. But if anybody has a story, feel free to email me to send it in, and it might be included in that episode. 

KS: Nice. 

CB: Yeah. All right. So back to that. Is there anything else you wanna mention about the Saturn-Jupiter conjunction, or about Saturn’s transit through Aquarius? How long – when is Saturn gonna leave Aquarius? Like, how long of a transit are we looking at here? 

KS: March 2023. 

AC: I believe it’s March… 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: Okay. So — 

KS: We’re on it! 

CB: Yeah. So that’s three years from now. So this is – we’re in this transit for the long haul, and this is gonna be a transit that’s sort of grinding through a certain house and a certain sector of everybody’s charts for the next three years. 

KS: The one thing that I think might be worth a little just a brief mention is that when two more significant, slower-moving planets like Jupiter and Saturn change signs and even when they form the conjunction, you may or may not notice something on the day. You know, when Mercury changes signs or Venus changes signs, usually we will feel a tone shift, you know, within 24 hours sometimes. Maybe not all the time, but just the idea that the slower moving planets – you may notice events right away and it might take you a few days or a few weeks to see the shift personally. It might be obvious in news headlines right away, but just at a personal level, you know? So when we’re saying the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction is on December 21st, that day may be significant, and it may just be more that sort of start of this longer trend that in hindsight you can see was a beginning but not always noticeable at the time. 

CB: Yeah, definitely. Especially if you have planets that Saturn is gonna hit exactly at some point later in the sign, that will be the beginning of that transit. But usually these things don’t start all at once, but instead you’ll start to see a slow shift in that energy as that new topic or that new house starts to become active in your chart in different ways. 

AC: Yeah. The more swiftly moving planets tend to describe more swiftly moving factors, whereas the slow ones describe slow things. And Saturn and Jupiter – and then some of those even further beyond – it’s a little bit more like the ground shifts rather than the figures on the ground shift. Right? It tends to be a little bit more of the world changing around people, rather than their action in the moment, right? As we are relatively swiftly moving, we tend to embody the more swiftly moving planets more easily. 

CB: Yeah. That makes sense. 

KS: Yeah, that’s a great point. 

CB: Somebody was asking us if the age of Aquarius is gonna start with this conjunction or to dismiss that, because apparently that’s going around a lot. But that’s like, a long-standing thing about like, the age of Aquarius and is that a thing and when does that begin, and different astrologers like, predicting different starting points for that based on a variety of different factors. Do you guys have any comments about the age of Aquarius? 

AC: I think it can be abbreviated pretty easily. So what is usually discussed as the age of Aquarius is a factor related to precession and it has to do with what constellation the vernal equinox in the northern hemisphere is in. This is not that. In a loose sense, is this an age of Aquarius – is this a time period with strong Aquarian themes? Absolutely. And it’d be – it’s I think very easy to confuse this with the processional age of Aquarius idea, because this conjunction – the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction – begins about 200 years of an age. It is an age or an era of air where Jupiter-Saturn conjunctions will be in air signs for quite some time. But it’s air; they’re not going to be in Aquarius the whole time. But this first 20 years is in a sense an age of Aquarius, but it’s not the 2000-year thing. 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: That’s a — 

CB: Kelly? 

KS: — perfect summary. I don’t know that I can — 

AC: Thank you. 

KS: — add anything to that. I’m like, “Yeah!” I can see – yeah? 

CB: Is the age of Aquarius a major core part of your astrological ideology and philosophy? 

KS: It’s not. 

CB: Okay. 

KS: But I understand where people can focus on it or hear about it and get excited about it, and you know, I totally get that. And similar to you, Austin, I can appreciate that we’re going into a 20 year cycle where there’s a lot of Aquarius signatures and themes that are gonna feature into this next 20 years. So it’s not technically what people are referring to when they say “the age of Aquarius,” because we’re not talking about procession when we’re talking about Jupiter and Saturn conjunct in Aquarius. But we are certainly getting Aquarian motifs coming forward, which will be part of the next 20 years, the next two decades. 

AC: Yeah. And I think it’ll look much more like cyberpunk dystopia than, you know, worldwide peace and understanding. 

CB: Yeah. Because that was always — 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: — the problem with the age of Aquarius procession thing is even though there was an underlying astrological thing that might be relevant or important, it often was kind of hijacked for idealistic, new age, theosophical religious purposes to say that it would be a golden age of this and this and this. And often the ideology got projected onto the astrology instead of what would normally be the reverse, which is the astrology informing the philosophy or what have you. So it often then whitewashed Aquarius to make it much better and more positive than it ever was traditionally instead of looking at it from more of a neutral standpoint of there’s some good things, but there’s also some challenges that come up at the same time, which I think is what you’re alluding to there with your cyberpunk dystopia metaphor, Austin. 

AC: Yeah. I would call it more of a sketch or an accurate description of the present and unfolding future. But yeah, it’s worth noting that these ideas about the age of Aquarius come from the period of time where people pretended that Saturn didn’t rule Aquarius. Right? 

CB: Right. 

AC: So it’s a lot easier — 

KS: Yes. 

AC: — to predict an ahistorical paradise when you get rid of Saturn. 

CB: Yeah. I mean, and we’ve already gotten a nice preview of that this year, which is like, you know, everybody – Saturn went into Aquarius and the entire world went into lockdown and we were all connected to each other through technology, through the internet. And all of a sudden, everybody’s doing Zoom meetings and relying on that in order to have social interactions. But then at the same time, in terms of like, physical presence, we’ve never been more separate and isolated from each other than at any other time. So there’s this dual sort of nature where on the one hand, it’s really great, and on the other hand – that we have that ability through technology to overcome boundaries – but then on the other hand there’s also a separateness and an isolation type tendency there at the same time that’s not as great, which is the Saturn thing. 

AC: Yeah, it’s very Saturn-flavored. 

KS: Yeah. Yeah, I remember when — 

AC: I mean, maybe the worldwide peace and love thing happened and I missed it. I mean, I know that some people really enjoyed baking for about two weeks during quarantine. There was some nice family — 

CB: That’s true. 

AC: I don’t think that quite qualifies, but you know, I’m open to be proven wrong. 

KS: Yeah. I remember when I did my talk on the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction this year. The talk I gave – I think it was in April of 2019. And I remember thinking, knowing we’re coming into this longer 200-year air elemental cycle, it makes me think about the internet being used more. And at the time, I was like, well, how else can we use the internet more? We’re already doing a lot online. And then — 

CB: Right. 

KS: — 2020 comes along, and here’s how you do more internet. And so I think there’s that. You know, what role does technology and gadgetry play going forward? And I also think one of the possible difficult manifestations of Saturn in Aquarius that I’m just mulling over is the idea of what are the negative consequences of a lack of human contact or a lack of social interaction for us as human beings? You know, what happens or what are the consequences when we can’t go to do things in person, and what kind of ramifications does that have? And I think that’s part of what we’ll be exploring as we go further into this. 

CB: Definitely. Also we’ve already seen and we were seeing it earlier this year, but what are the limits of the spread of information where this is also like, the Saturn return of the internet and the worldwide web specifically, which was formed with Saturn in early Aquarius in the early ‘90s. And then one of the things we saw coming up in, you know, March, April, May was sometimes like, certain companies on the internet that previously had the free distribution of information starting to clamp down and starting to put rules and limitations on certain things like spreading disinformation about covid or what have you. And this discussion that’ll probably perhaps become more important about like, what are the limits of that, or to what extent is that a necessary thing to have some rules and limitations imposed on the internet or on certain sources of information on the internet, versus at what point does that go too far and become something that’s infringing on whatever – free speech or the free expression of ideas and communication and things like that. 

AC: Yeah. Huge theme, especially probably huge theme for decades, but huge theme especially the next few years while Saturn’s in Aquarius squaring Uranus. Right? Because Uranus is freedom, and Saturn is rules. And so there’s always a discussion and a relationship between those two, but they’re, you know, they’re at a most contentious angle to one another for the next couple years in a row, which makes sense, right? 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: Totally. 

CB: And also Saturn and restrictions and limitations and Aquarius being an air sign, which is more about communication and the exchange of things like ideas or concepts. 

AC: Data. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: Yeah. But at least in the first part of it, there’ll be some sort of positive boost for the first year, and I think that’s gonna be qualitatively a lot different than the next – the following two years of Saturn’s transit through Aquarius kind of on its own. At least in the first year we get this sort of expansive, a bit more optimistic and maybe somewhat rapid boost with Jupiter being there at the same time over the course of most of 2021, although Jupiter dips out of Aquarius and moves into Pisces for a little bit around May, I think. 

KS: Yes. 

AC: So as a like, slightly alternate read to that, I was saying to Kelly earlier – I think you had to dip out for a second – that I’ve been seeing the Saturn-Jupiter copresence which we had in Capricorn in 2020 and which we’ll have in Aquarius for three-quarters of 2021 as Jupiter being able to help Saturn, but Saturn limiting Jupiter. And so instead of bringing a Jupiterian quality, Jupiter just affirms and strengthens whatever the Saturnian mood, agenda, or rules program is. 

CB: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Especially it’s nice, at least, with this, unlike let’s say the previous conjunction in 2000 was Saturn and Jupiter in Taurus, which is a sign that neither of them really has any dignity. In this one, at least there Saturn has dignity, and there is therefore reception especially when Jupiter’s applying to Saturn, so that Jupiter is helping and strengthening Saturn but the relationship of the conjunction is a little bit softer than it might be otherwise. 

AC: Well, and it’s interesting when we’re looking at this Jupiter-Saturn cycle. You know, in some signs, Jupiter is very strong. And in some signs, Saturn is very strong. And the one that we’re doing now which sets the tone for the next 20 years is indubitably Saturn’s place. And Jupiter isn’t useless or powerless in Aquarius, but while Saturn is there is very much very limited in its ability to accomplish things that are outside of whatever the Saturnian parameters or structure are. 

And so but this is – and Kelly, you and I have been talking about this. So whenever we look at Jupiter being in a place for a year or something like that, we’re talking about opportunities for growth, right? What can get better? And so in reading this, okay, it’s gonna be Jupiter with Saturn for most of another year, but with a delightful interlude, but nine months. Then that means almost treating Saturn as Jupiter, right? Being like, okay, the growth and all these happy, Jupiterian things are gonna come through figuring the Saturn out, rather than sort of an independent, free-floating Jupiter thing. 

KS: Yeah. I think it’s… You know… I think it was you, Austin, earlier that was mentioning the rules and laws and things like that which are very Saturnian type things. And with Jupiter just in the mix there, I don’t know whether there can be collaboration or… One thing I think about Aquarius that’s different from Capricorn is there is an authoritarian quality, but it’s slightly more communal focused. You know, in Capricorn, we don’t see that as much. So whether Jupiter is just enhancing Saturn, you know, to the benefit of Saturn or there is some sort of collective – I think about an air sign, it’s a humane sign. There’s something, you know, this is very much about the human experience and human constructs and human rules and rules of engagement and things like that. 

AC: Yeah, definitely.

CB: So speaking of your point about Jupiter helping to reinforce Saturn and being channeled through Saturn, that actually might be a good opportunity to mention our electional chart for this month. 

So Leisa Schaim and I, we do our monthly Auspicious Elections Podcast which we just recorded last night for December. But a year ago, we sat down and started looking at elections for 2020, and we did this for our yearly report where we pick out one electional chart for each month which is like, the best electional chart we could find and sold that, and we’re actually gonna – we’re putting that together now. We’re gonna do another one for 2021 which will hopefully be out sometime in the next few weeks. But I remember last year around, what was it, like, November or so when we put that together, one of the fun and unique things that we had to do was we wanted to pick out an electional chart for the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction that would take place in December. And this is my first time, you know, the last one was 20 years ago when I was just getting into astrology, so this is my first time picking out an electional chart for a highly unique conjunction like that, and it was a really fun exercise. 

But this is the electional chart – or at least one of – this was the primary electional chart that we wanted to feature for the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction in December, and it takes place on December 19th, 2020, at around 9:30 in the morning in Denver, Colorado. And basically you just wanna set it for that time in your city or location, and then adjust the chart until the Ascendant is at about one degree of Aquarius. And that’s gonna put Aquarius rising and the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction – Jupiter and Saturn are both at zero degrees of Aquarius; they’ve both just moved from Capricorn into Aquarius, and they’re gonna be in the first whole sign house conjunct the degree of the Ascendant. So this is slightly before the conjunction. So Jupiter is actually still applying to Saturn, but in this context that’s actually a very positive thing because we’re making Saturn the ruler of the Ascendant. And this is basically – if you were to run through your checklist of doing a Saturn election, this is probably one of the best Saturn elections I’ve ever seen because it just checks all of the boxes where Saturn is in its own sign of Aquarius, it’s in a day chart, it is in the first house conjunct the exact degree of the Ascendant. It has the benefic of the sect, which is Jupiter, applying to a conjunction with it, it has no affliction from Mars, which is the malefic contrary to the sect. It even has a nice little sextile from Venus, which is up at five degrees of Sagittarius in the 11th whole sign house, sextiling Saturn at zero degrees of Aquarius. 

So it’s an excellent Saturn election. It’s also a good fixed sign election for things that you want to be firm and long-lasting, which are also Saturn significations. The Moon is in Pisces in the 2nd house, and it’s applying to a square with Venus. So that checks another box, which is that we get the Moon applying to a benefic. And finally the last thing is that it also incorporates a Sun-Mercury conjunction that’s happening around the same time – a cazimi between Mercury and the Sun where the Sun is at 28°14’ Sag in the 11th house, and Mercury is at 27°58’ – so it’s applying within one degree of that conjunction. 

Yeah, and that is our auspicious election for this month. It’s pretty good for the first house, pretty good for the 11th house. Mars is in the 3rd house; it has some mitigations because it’s in its own domicile. It’s overcome by sign by both benefics, and it’s moving forward instead of retrograde still. So there could be some challenges with 3rd house things related to communication, travel, or siblings, but otherwise it’s a pretty solid electional chart, all things considered. The only thing we cannot get rid of is the fact that we’re gonna be experiencing that Saturn-Uranus square all next year, especially in the first quarter, I think, is when it goes exact for the first time. But luckily it’s not super close in this instance. Uranus is at seven degrees of Taurus in the 4th whole sign house, and Saturn is at zero degrees. So as long as you keep that Ascendant early and don’t delay and put the Ascendant at like, seven degrees of Aquarius, it shouldn’t be too acute. But it’s certainly something to be aware of. 

That’s our electional chart. What do you guys think? 

KS: You’ve ticked a lot of — 

AC: I think there’s a lot to like. 

KS: Yeah, there’s a lot of boxes ticked. Yeah. I feel like I wanna go out — 

AC: It also remind — 

KS: — with my stone chisel and carve something into the stone or something. 

CB: Yeah, something permanent. Long-lasting. 

AC: Yeah. And so this reminded me of one of my Jupiter-Saturn points – this Jupiter-Saturn in Aquarius points – is that in a lot of the traditional electional material, there’s a strong – especially Dorotheus – there’s a very strong preference for if you can, all other things being equal, to get a fixed sign rising. And you mentioned that if you wanted to establish something that would be firm and fixed and enduring, that getting a fixed sign rising is good, and Saturn and Jupiter in the first in a fixed sign – they’ll be angular no matter which fixed sign that you put on the Ascendant – is going to be on offer for a lot of the next year. And that also, you know, we can use that on purpose, but it also means that a lot of things are going to be begun at times that speak to their long-lasting effect. Which is like, yet another way of looking at, oh, this is the opening of a 20-year era, of a three-year era, of a couple hundred year era. This is, you know, many of the things which begin under that Saturn-Jupiter will endure for quite some time for, you know, good, evil, and everything in between. 

CB: Yeah. Definitely. So that’s our good electional chart for the month. We’ve got I think three or four including some variations of our Saturn-Jupiter conjunction electional chart in The Auspicious Elections podcast, which I think we’ll be releasing later today or tomorrow for patrons on the five dollar tiers and higher. So you can get access to that through our page on Patreon. Otherwise that is the electional chart for this month. So good luck everybody who tries to capture that Jupiter-Saturn election; I hope you use it for something good and not some blow-off thing like getting ice cream or something like that. That’s probably not the best idea for that Jupiter-Saturn conjunction, but you know, to each his own. 

AC: Well, the coldness of Saturn may be to your great advantage there. 

CB: Yeah, that’s true. Maybe you get ice cream and then you end up — 

AC: It won’t melt. 

CB: They end up selling you the place, and then you buy your first ice cream shop and end up becoming an ice cream mogul over the course of the next decade.

KS: The next 20 years. Yeah. 

I mean, what you were just saying there, Austin, I think you did a really nice succinct job of talking about how there’s a three-year Saturn in Aquarius cycle starting. There’s a 20-year Saturn-Jupiter cycle starting. Oh, and there’s this 200-year air elemental Jupiter-Saturn conjunction thing starting! So you know, to the points that we’re making, these are the start of things that will take time. So it’s not like, oh, I’m starting something and I’m finishing it next week. I’m starting something and maybe I’m even gonna have to do some planning or some research or some preparation so that as I move forward into these cycles, the thing that I’m putting my energy into is something that I really value and I do want to have that long-lasting relationship with. And I want this – you know, because it’s long chapters. This is not Mars changing signs where we’ve got a project for six to eight weeks. This is, you know, at least two years, and I mean, most of us won’t live for 200 years, so maybe we can think in 20-year cycles to think a bit more productively or constructively. But this second half of December with all these planets changing signs feels like a really good time to be thoughtful about where you wanna go next, knowing that whatever you agree to or put your energy into, it’s not gonna be a quick solution basically. And that’s okay. There are great things that take time that are worthy of our effort, but thoughtfulness at the start of that pays off during that longer timeframe. 

CB: Yeah. That’s really good Saturn advice. Things that start slow but end up being long-lasting if they’re successful, and that do the best when there’s a lot of preparation ahead of time. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: Yeah. I think a little bit about picking which train you’re gonna get on. Right? You have a lot of choice before you get on the train, but once the train leaves the station, you know, it might be the Trans-Siberian, right? You might be on there for six weeks or more. 

KS: Yeah. There’s an equivalent in Australia – like, a train, I’m not sure of its proper name, but it goes through the center of the country and once you’re on it, you’re just going for days. 

CB: And Kelly, you mentioned this is the opening of a cycle of like, the 20-year cycle and the 200-year cycle, but even this is also the opening and the foundation of a thousand-year cycle, because the next time we’ll have a shift — 

KS: That’s true. 

CB: — like this of it shifting back into air signs like it’s doing now will be a thousand years from now, approximately. 

KS: Yeah, it’s about 800 — 

AC: 800. 

KS: — years I think. Yeah. 

CB: Yeah. Right. 

KS: Yeah. But you’re right, Chris, and that’s one thing that we often do forget is okay, we’re switching elements to last for a couple of hundred years, but it’s been 800 years since we did air element collectively as a human race. And it’ll be another 800 years before we do air element. So this is our time to do air element stuff — 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: — collectively. 

CB: And that was the way historical astrology was used and developed in the medieval period amongst the Persian and Arabic astrologers was to divide these huge periods of time and study like, the rise and falls of different religions and dynasties and things like that. 

AC: Yeah. And another thing which I’ve been kind of playing with and maybe have some work to release, but I gotta get to it, is that these techniques were also used to forecast like, sort of world historic figures, which in the sort of Abrahamic faiths looks like figuring out when a prophet will come. And so I’ve been in my head for like, the last year or so on and off kind of trying to take apart that notion, assuming that it’s not just Abrahamic prophets, but like, what do world historic figures look like? Because when I’ve looked back at these phases, especially the beginning of one of these 200 years, you often have a figure or figures who we still remember today. So for example, at the beginning of the period of mean conjunctions in air, a little after 1200, Genghis Khan changes the entire world, right? And it might be strange to refer to Genghis Khan as a prophet, but in terms of like, a figure whose actions impact the world. And we see similar figures like this, like Charlemagne, et cetera, et cetera. And so I’ve been thinking about that, because that’s something that there’s a lot of focus in the Arabic texts on looking at Muhammad at the beginning of the water 200 years and then looking back, et cetera, et cetera. 

CB: Yeah. That’s a really good point. And we’ll see some of that shift, perhaps, in the news and in the world around us. But there’s gonna be some things that are gonna happen or are gonna be born and start out very small, perhaps around the time of this shift, around the time of this conjunction, that we won’t see and realize the significance of until much later. 

KS: Yeah. So much – we could go on a massive tangent about this! 

AC: Yeah. And well, I mean, we’ll be coming back to dwell upon all of this again next month for the yearly. Because all — 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — of this is relevant to the yearly. 

CB: Yeah. All right, so we can move on from that. Somebody in the chat has mentioned a couple of times the Mars-Pluto square that’s gonna happen and go exact here in December. I don’t know if you guys have any thoughts about this. This will be the third and last of the Mars-Pluto squares. It looks like it’s going exact around December 23rd, and it’s kind of close in proximity to some of those other major things happening. 

Any comments? 

KS: Well, I mean, just at a very simple level, it looks a little hot and combustible, and that’s partly the Mars square Pluto. But it’s the last Moon conjunct Mars aspect as well in Aries, I think, if I’ve calculated that correctly. So it’s just an interesting thing that we get that going as well as the Mars-Pluto. So whether that’s, you know, a disagreement, a day where you’re dealing with some tension or a difference of opinions, it does feel like it will be, yeah, a little uncomfortable. Not – I don’t know, it’s the 3rd. This will be, you know, it’s our third one. It’s weirdly Mars was making a lot of squares to Saturn and to Jupiter through the middle of the year, but they’ve moved on now, so this is like, Mars coming back, and the only planet left for Mars to interact with by square is Pluto. So whether we see some power themes come through, control dynamics I think as well. What are you guys thinking about that? 

AC: About Mars square Pluto? 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: Yeah, it brings up frustrations with power dynamics. A lot of – in particular with Pluto, it’s usually not overtly stated power dynamics or like, clear rules that you get the marital anger rebellion against. It’s like, you know, it’s deeper, unstated structural things with Pluto in Capricorn. It might be structural, but it’s like, assumed or unstated or maybe even unrecognized. You know, Pluto is interested in negation. And so there’s this like, frustration or feeling of being negated from Mars’s perspective that often creates an uncomfortable moments over a couple of days.

KS: Yeah, that’s what I was thinking about like, in our day to day lives, what is this gonna feel like or what are some of the events we might deal with, and it feels like maybe even the 48-hour window that the Moon is in Aries, this is just a little bit of that last Mars – sort of the last Aries-Capricorn sort of dynamic for the year, really. We’ve been dealing with that interaction with various planetary interplays for six months, and this will be the last of those. 

Yeah, so you know, I feel – it’s right before the Christmas timeframe. So for people who celebrate that, maybe there is some pressure about last-minute things or disagreements with family or what have you. If you’ve got maybe a physical undertaking, if you can burn off some of this heat. I mean, sometimes I like to say be physical when there’s a lot of Aries Mars, but then it’s also like, be careful with being physical because we can also injure ourselves. So it’s a little bit of maybe there would be a couple of days this month where I’m like, just take a little care if you can. 

AC: Yeah. It looks like a potentially irritating couple days. 

KS: Yeah. 

Chris, did you wanna throw in anything on the Mars-Pluto? 

CB: I’m trying to think of like, Mars-Pluto natives that I know just to give an example of context. I mean, one I knew had like, a close Mars-Pluto conjunction in the 12th house, and just could be obsessive about their enemies and could just have these great explosions of temper, of like, holding it in but then when it was released it would just be like, this huge mushroom cloud of anger and things like that. So sometimes I think of that when I think of Mars-Pluto things is this like, intense concentration of energy that can sometimes be unleashed. 

AC: Yeah. I think pressurized release is definitely a theme. 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: Pressurized release, the use of force and the controlled use of force and sometimes manipulation of that is always – control issues are always issues with Pluto and the attempts to control or manipulate things behind the scenes. Yeah. So it’s not – it’s a little tricky of an aspect. It’s the third time we’ve had it this year, but it’s gonna be the final time. And then Mars is finally moving on and sailing through the rest of Aries throughout the rest of December and not hitting any other exact aspects before it eventually moves into Taurus and finally leaves – what degree did it go retrograde at? 

KS: 28, I think? 

AC: 28? 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: Okay. So there it is. It finally hits its shadow; it leaves its shadow period by like, January 1st, January 2nd. And then we’re finally done with that Mars retrograde which dominated the entire second half of the year basically. 

AC: Yeah. And it’s worth noting that for all of December, Mars is slowly picking up speed and getting back to something resembling a normal pace. Because even though Mars stationed direct and reversed motion in the middle of November, it’s basically just sat there for a month as December begins. It’s barely moved at all. And so we start seeing some actual speed and motion as we get through December, which is good, which is useful for getting things done. A lot of times when planets are stationary, especially Mars, which is a planet of effort and exertion and work and problem-solving – when it’s standing still, often the problem stands still, or one’s motion towards solutions is similarly slow. And so a little bit of speed isn’t the worst thing. 

KS: And one other factor – I completely agree with what you were saying there, Austin – and the other piece that I think is going to make it more possible for Mars to do the things that Mars is trying to do or help the general pace pick up will be that ingress of Saturn into Aquarius, because it removes Saturn from the overcoming position. And Mars has been dealing with that the entire time that it’s been in Aries. So this last few weeks of Mars in Aries after Saturn has left Capricorn, Mars has a level of – whether it’s freedom or autonomy or independence, you know, he’s able to operate without that overbearing sort of strict authority overseeing figure that he’s been dealing with since he moved into Aries nearly six months ago. 

CB: That’s a great point. 

AC: Yeah, absolutely. It’s just square Pluto; it’s not squaring Pluto and Saturn. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: Right? 

CB: Yeah. So Saturn and like, slowness of movement and also retrogrades and slowness of movement, and this sort of being impeded in a sense has been one of the big lessons this year in terms of Saturn aspects, in terms of Capricorn and in terms of planetary stations. 

AC: Yeah. And so let me say something that I can’t believe I didn’t say earlier. One of the best things about Saturn moving into Aquarius is it breaks the Saturn-Pluto both being in the same decan of Capricorn together, a copresence which we’ve had all year which we’ve talked about an awful lot, but historically Saturn-Pluto is, you know, a diseased totalitarian nightmare configuration. And so not having that is fantastic! Like, it’s gonna take them a while to separate in terms of absolute degrees, but just getting that sign boundary between them – I’m a huge fan of. 

KS: Cosign on that. 

CB: Yeah. Definitely. Although even – it’s like, some of the shift, you know, we’ll still be dealing with some of the shift that the Saturn-Pluto conjunction left with us. And I know at the beginning – it’s interesting in retrospect. Do you remember – I think it was you and me and Patrick that did the Saturn in Capricorn episode, Austin, and a lot of the stuff we talked about about boundaries, things with prisons, things with totalitarianism or a tendency towards that have become so strikingly and literally true over the past few years that it’s been really striking now thinking about it in retrospect just how that’s worked out, you know? 

AC: Yeah. Of all the astrological things to be utterly literal, that’s my least favorite. And so, like, that’s a once every 40-ish year conjunction depending on how fast Pluto’s moving. But and so no, it doesn’t just go away overnight. But it’s not – to a certain degree, while they’re still copresent, those loathsome dynamics are still being fed. And so at least once Saturn moves into Aquarius and we get that sign boundary in between, at least we’re starting to move away from that. We’re starting – like, it’s no longer being actively grown. It might be there, right, but that’s different than like, you know, being given high-quality baby food or whatever — 

KS: Nourishment. 

AC: — you feed a Saturn-Pluto nightmare. 

CB: Yeah. Although even, you know, we’ll still be experiencing some of the things that were the result of that period over the past two to three years. I mean, I remember one of the statements that different astrologers made and I think was made even in that episode was the empowerment or more conservative elements of society. And it was interesting after our last forecast episode, literally that day – we didn’t talk about it, because it was still in the process, but I think it was that night that in the US, Amy Coney Barrett, the new Supreme Court Justice, was approved that day. And that’s already had – there was a ruling just a few days ago where the Supreme Court blocked – there was some health restrictions on churches due to covid, but that was struck down by the Supreme Court because it now has a conservative majority on the Supreme Court, which will then sort of shift subsequent legislation presumably as long as that continues to be the case for the next few years. So there’s things that came out of the last few years and that last bit of that pileup in Capricorn that we’ll still be experiencing for a while into the future. 

AC: Yeah, definitely. Well, and if we look at the last time we had a strong Saturn-Pluto configuration – which was the opposition, which is basically the configuration that best timed 9/11 – and we looked at security state stuff, especially United States, you know, we got all the Patriot Act stuff that was used as a justification for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. And those didn’t end the second that Saturn and Pluto became, you know, lost their configuration. So there is inertia behind those things. But at least it’s like, you know, I’m just a fan of any distance we can put between ourselves and that. It’s a good thing even if it’s not a fix.

KS: Yeah. Step in the right direction, at least. 

CB: Yeah. Sign-based aspects matter. All right. Go ahead Kelly. 

KS: I was gonna say, on that note, the Sun moving into Capricorn December 21st, the solstice, is the first time in three years that all of our Capricorn listeners and Sun in Capricorn friends will be able to enjoy their birthday season without Saturn around to quell the celebration. So that’s — 

CB: That’s huge. 

KS: — just a little sidebar. Yeah. 

CB: Yeah, that’s huge. I mean, there’s this huge — 

KS: It’s massive. 

CB: — shift away from the cardinal signs have just been getting nailed this year by so much planetary activity. And having Saturn move out of Capricorn, having Jupiter move out of Capricorn, and soon within a few weeks having Mars move out of Aries is just this huge alleviation and exhale and breath or sigh of relief for a lot of the cardinal sign placements or anybody that has a heavy emphasis on cardinal signs in their chart. 

AC: Hallelujah. 

KS: Yes. 

CB: You say as a — 

KS: That’s worth — 

CB: — somebody with a little bit of cardinal. 

AC: Indeed, yeah. Late cardinal especially. 

CB: Yeah. Later degrees – that last decan and that second half of the last decan. 

AC: In the great astrological relay race, those of us with important late cardinal placements get to hand off the suffering baton gladly. 

CB: Yeah. So now everything is moving into – not everything, but we’re getting this shift that’s happening into fixed sign placements and mutable placements. And I mention the mutables only because the eclipses are moving into that axis, whereas they had been in cardinal signs, which is another funny thing, up to this point – how the cardinal signs were even getting hit by the eclipses. It wasn’t even just, you know, Saturn and Jupiter and Pluto and Mars. But there’s a real shift away from that. Eclipses are moving to mutable signs, and Jupiter and Saturn are moving to fixed signs. And so yeah, the fixed signs are gonna have more of the emphasis of some of the heavy outer planet energy this year. 

AC: Yeah. True, but even so, one of the things that I like about where we’re going as opposed to where we’ve been is, as you said, there was a concentration of malefics on one axis – or even in one sign – for a lot of this year. And just getting the problem spread out so it’s not all of the problems in one place. You know, one of the things that – one principle in astrology that this year has reaffirmed for me is that you can deal with one problem at a time, but two on one or three on one just changes the odds. It’s like, you know, you can be tough and rough and tumble, and maybe you can take any one person in a fight, but three people at once? Like, suddenly somebody’s punching you in the back of the head. You know, no matter how much of a badass you are. And that same team-up dynamic, it isn’t three times as hard; it’s 10 times as hard. And so just declustering the malefics is really nice, because it takes that like, getting ganged up on by life feeling out of it.

CB: Right. Even if you’re Jackie Chan, Jackie Chan still takes some punches in the back of the head every once in a while. 

AC: Yeah. Although he – I mean, he does pretty well in the big group fights, but they are choreographed so he wins. 

CB: That’s true. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: I don’t think they were that choreographed for the cardinal signs this year. It was a little bit more raw. 

KS: Very rough. It’s been very rough. Yeah. 

CB: All right. So there’s one last major thing I think that happens in December we needed to mention very briefly, which is what’s actually technically our second lunation of the month, which is that Full Moon that takes place in Cancer on the 29th. 

KS: Yes. Again, for the first time without Saturn on the same axis in a few years.

AC: Just like a — 

CB: Nice. 

AC: — normal — 

CB: Okay. 

AC: — Full Moon in Cancer. 

KS: Yeah. And I personally am a little bit partial to the Full Moon in Cancer because it can be nourishing; it can be calming or soothing or point towards sanctuary and safety. And you know, having some nesting time. I usually look forward to this Full Moon, you know, whenever it is sometime from late December through January, and the last few years it’s been blocked in its ability to water or nourish or feel as comfortable. So you know, I know it’s gentle; I know there’s not great benefic alignment to it, I guess, but I’m looking forward to it. As you said, it’s just a straight-up Full Moon in Cancer. 

CB: Yeah. I think last year we joked about there being like, no hugs in March, and that was partially tied into like, some of the Capricorn stuff. But this is, you know, it’s finally free of Saturn – Full Moon in Cancer – so maybe it’s okay to hug again, or it’s a hug-returning Full Moon. Is that what you’re saying, Kelly? 

KS: Yeah, I mean, I don’t know if I’d go quite that far. It is still square to Mars, but — 

CB: Okay. 

KS: It’s not as much fear, maybe. 

CB: Okay. 

KS: I don’t know. What would you guys say? 

AC: Well, so, you know, for an archetypally glorious Moon, right, we would want the Full Moon in Cancer configured strongly to benefics. Right? 

KS: Yes. 

AC: And so we don’t have that, but we also don’t have it configured to malefics, or just only vaguely; it’s more than a day’s motion before it — 

KS: Before it gets near Mars. 

AC: Right? 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: And so it’s just like, it’s actually not bad! Right? And — 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — I would say that the Moon in its own domicile and full of light is going to act like a benefic. And so it’s just like, it’s Moon! It’s comforting. Like, there’s some level of support, comfort, nurturance. You know, it’s just not bad, and that’s such a nice change of pace. Because we’ve been, you know, we’ve been — 

KS: These are our standards —

AC: — acclimated — 

KS: — after 2020!

AC: Yeah! you know, and for years with the Moon in Cancer, right — 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — we’ve become acclimated to only kind of terrible as being a real win. 

KS: Yes. 

AC: Whereas this is — 

KS: And this is above that. 

AC: — actually kind of nice! 

KS: Yeah. We can use a — 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: — positive qualifier in here. 

CB: I mean,t here’s even a somewhat dreamy quality to the simultaneous square between Venus and Neptune that’s also taking place where it looks like within 24 hours of this Full Moon, Venus completes a square from 18 degrees of Sagittarius to 18 degrees of Pisces with Neptune, which has a dreamy, idealistic sort of quality in terms of relationships or other Venusian activities. Sometimes that can be really nice in the moment. Other times it can also be a little bit distracting or a little bit not grounded in terms of being fully in touch with reality. But sometimes that can be good for the time being. 

AC: Yeah, I’m good with that. 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: All right. And so then that – and within basically a day or two of that, then Mars leaves its shadow and passes over that degree that it went retrograde at way back in, what, September? And so that means that Mars, especially if you have planets around the later degrees of cardinal signs, that’s gonna be the final pass – probably the third pass – that you will get of Mars making exact hard aspect to all of your stuff. So that will be the final thing that sort of brings some completion or some closure to this year of what especially for the cardinal signs have been somewhat difficult transits. And then it really closes it out right at the end of the year on New Year’s Eve and opens it up for January and a new beginning. 

KS: Whole new ballgame. 

CB: So it doesn’t always work out like that I think we talked about in our year ahead forecast, but for some reason, there is a definite sense of December bringing culminations and the ending of cycles and the completions of a lot of things, and then the opening up of some fresh new chapters which takes us into January and into 2021. 

AC: Yeah. It’s definitely the end of an era according to several different timeframes. 

CB: Right. 

KS: Yeah. Yes. 

CB: Beautiful. Well — 

KS: New software being installed. 

CB: New software. 

AC: We successfully crash land into the future. 

KS: Into the future, yeah. 

AC: And begin exploring. 

CB: There’s a little image for this month and just where the planets start and where they will end up. And I think that brings us to a nice ending place. Are there any other things from – let me just check our outline to see if there’s anything we meant to mention. There’s some little like, sidenote things. One of the things that was funny – unless you guys have anything else to say about the forecast – Snapchat installed just like, rolled out this month a birth chart feature where all of a sudden, you enter your birthdate, time, and location and it actually calculates your chart relatively accurately, including your Big Three, but also all of your other planetary positions, and gives you some little basic interpretations. And that’s kind of a big deal, because Snapchat’s literally one of the most popular apps used on phones across the world, and they just rolled out a built-in birth chart feature basically, which is kind of striking. 

KS: That’s — 

CB: You guys — 

KS: — very cool. 

CB: — excited about that? Now you can send birth charts on your Snapchat — 

KS: On your snaps? 

CB: — accounts? 

KS: I mean — 

CB: Yeah. 

KS: — I think I’m too old for snaps! Not like, I’m actually too old; I’m just, I’m a very late adopter, and that means sometimes I don’t get there, and I think that’s one of the things that I didn’t get there with. 

CB: All right, well there’s still time.

KS: I’m just not very good — 

CB: Maybe you’ll be — 

KS: — with these things! 

CB: — a adopter in the early 2020s. 

KS: Who knows what 2021 will bring! 

AC: I would say that I’m old enough that I don’t even know if it would be appropriate for me to use Snapchat, which probably is a definite no. 

KS: Yeah. 

CB: Yeah. That’s a good point. 

AC: Like, I have a vague knowledge that that’s something that younger people – I think – use? 

KS: God, we sound so old right now! 

AC: That’s all right. 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: We kind of are. 

KS: It’s okay! Aging is something I’m very happy about, because the alternative is not aging, which I would not like! Yeah. 

AC: I’m still trying to work on the whole vampirism thing, but it’s not going that well – the whole undead immortality. I’ve made some progress, but not quick enough. 

KS: Not quick enough. Somebody in the chat is talking about filters. I just figured out how to use filters on Instagram! Like, I’m really not good – and people who know me in my personal life are like, “That’s standard,” for me. But I also feel like – I just wanna take, like, okay, and just like that – 2020 is done. Just like that! We just — 

CB: Yeah — 

KS: — got to the end. Just, it’s done! That’s it!

CB: It’s over. That’s it. It was a long haul. It was a very long slog there for a little bit with the, yeah, just the slowness and the excruciating how long everything was taking. But you’re right; now it’s over all of a sudden. It was this time last year that we were out here during the year ahead forecast and recording the December forecast for 2019 and then the year ahead forecast for 2020. 

AC: Yeah, almost exactly a year ago. 

KS: Yeah. Wow. What a 12 months. 

CB: Yeah. A lot can change in one year. And yeah, we learned a lot. There was a lot of hard stuff everybody went through to different levels. But definitely as astrologers, I think we learned a lot, and it’s been nice having these monthly and the yearly forecast to, you know,make our expectations about the upcoming time periods known, and then actually living through that together collectively and observing what actually happened was a really fascinating experience. 

AC: Yeah, absolutely. 

KS: Yes. 

AC: Absolutely. And from an astrologer’s point of view, I’m really glad to have some of this stuff in the rearview. Because I was like, oh, what’s that gonna be? It’s gonna be awful. What’s that gonna be? It’s gonna be awful! Like, it just like, okay, just turn over the cards and then we can deal with it. But knowing that, you know, looking at the various configurations this year and just being like, ugh! You know, no matter how difficult something is, it’s always been to have it receding in the rearview. You can begin repairing, reworking, rethinking, putting distance between that and your current trajectory. 

CB: Yeah. And it’s been really interesting experience also as professional astrologers that find balance that we’ve always – every astrologer tries to walk the line and is difficult between being honest without being overly pessimistic, but then on the other side as we’ve talked about many times this year, we’ve seen the potential downside of not talking honestly about what’s coming up and that it looks difficult. Because what happens if some really heavy stuff actually happens in the world, and you know, you just said only the positive parts? Like, if we only focused on Jupiter this year and we didn’t mention any of that other stuff that was going on – you know, that might not have worked out as well, because it would have been not actually describing what everybody was going through this year. 

AC: Yeah. Or it would have been kind of accurate, but in a hilarious way. Like, Jupiter’s in a Saturn-ruled sign, so you know, think about you’re really gonna experience a lot of growth by having less options. 

KS: By being restricted — 

CB: Right. 

AC: You didn’t tell me I’d be locked in my house! Right? I thought — 

KS: Yeah. 

AC: — it was a metaphor! 

CB: Yeah. Well, I still remember like, in January I got this really angry Instagram message from somebody that said that our forecasts – I’m not sure if it was the year ahead forecast, or it might have been the horoscopes that Leisa and I did for each rising sign – they said they were too negative, and they said that you shouldn’t make negative statements with astrology because everything ultimately works out for the best and is positive or something like that. And they really objected to the way that we had framed much of 2020. But then they wrote me back like, a few months later, and said that their wedding had been canceled due to the pandemic and they were kind of like, “Now I understand. Good call.” And that was an interesting experience as well, seeing that side of it, because prior to this year – and certainly going into the year ahead forecast – I was nervous about bumming people out too much and going too far and saying how difficult some of the configurations looked like. But then, yeah. Now we can see the other side of that. So — 

KS: Makes sense. Consistent. Consistent with the symbolism. 

CB: Yeah. So it’s been a good experience; we’ve all learned a lot this year, and it’s been great doing that together with you guys and going through that learning experience with the two of you and then also with our audience and all the comments and feedback we hear from everybody which we appreciate and definitely helps us a lot. 

KS: Yes. Thank you all. It’s been a real privilege and an honor to sit down with you guys every month and be able to kind of keep tabs and go into everything, and thank you to everyone who listens because we wouldn’t really have a show without you, so we appreciate it. 

CB: Definitely. 

AC: Absolutely. 

CB: So we have just scheduled our year ahead forecast when we’re gonna do the recording for that, and I believe it’s scheduled for December 18th at 11 AM to record our forecast for the entire year ahead for 2021, which will also kind of cover our forecast for January as well as the next 12 months. So that’s gonna be something if anybody wants to attend live, like we have an audience who attended live here, you can sign up through our page on Patreon and I’ll send out the webinar registration link sometime in the next probably two to three weeks. So looking forward to that. We’ve got some preparation to do to looking at 2021 and seeing what’s gonna be coming up in the forecast over the next year. But I’m really looking forward to that. 

Do you guys have any news or announcements of things you have coming up in December? 

KS: Just I don’t have anything coming up in December, but I do have my 2021 year ahead webinar on January the 2nd. So it’s a 90-minute exploration of the year ahead that I’ll be doing in collaboration with Astrology University. It’s a little bit of an early announcement, but I think by the time that we put this live, I know we’ve got an audience here now, but by the time we publish this, Chris, it’ll be up on the website, so. Yeah! That’s it for me. What about you guys? 

CB: What do you got going on, Austin? 

AC: Let’s see. Sphere and Sundry may release a Venus in Taurus series that I elected. Maybe not. I think that’s still under discussion. And I guess, you know, I’ll be talking about the year to come with y’all, and then I will also be talking about the next six months with Gordon White on the 18th for us and the 19th for me and Gordon. Other than that, just wrapping up my yearly business. 

CB: Awesome. 

KS: Yes. 

CB: Sounds good. Let’s see, I did need to mention our friends at the Honeycomb Collective Personal Astrological Almanac, who are our sponsor this month, wanted me to give people a head’s up that now’s the time to order your almanacs if you’re looking to get one, especially in time for Christmas. So if you order it now, you can get it in time for the end of the year. 

The other thing is that they released a wall calendar, which is like, a fully personalized wall calendar just like their almanac that ties into your natal chart. It shows like, an ephemeris each month, but it also shows exact transits that you’re having on any given day as well as you can add different things like their zodiacal releasing dates from their Hellenistic plug-in and a bunch of other things like solar returns, community artwork, and a lot of other great stuff in terms of the aspects and the astrology of each month of 2021. 

So each of the wall calendars starts at 25 dollars, and you can add different things to it. You can find out more information about that at Honeycomb.co. 

And speaking of wall calendars, I’m actually – we’re getting ready to release – we’re putting the final touches on our wall calendar, our usual The Astrology Podcast year-at-a-glance calendar right now, and I’m getting that set up. So hopefully sometime in the next few weeks I’ll be able to make an announcement about that on the podcast website or through our mailing list. Just in case anybody wants to order one of those, we are doing them; I’m just trying to finalize the print-on-demand this month – this year – to do a different set up since I don’t wanna go to the post office a bunch. 

And Austin has a gigantic feline friend at this point who’s grown in size to be the size of a small tiger almost. 

AC: Giant baby. 

CB: Wow. 

AC: She is almost exactly six months. 

CB: That is not — 

KS: Oh, look at her! 

CB: Does not even look like the same cat. 

KS: It doesn’t. It’s amazing how — 

AC: Yeah, she — 

KS: — quickly they fill out. 

AC: She was supersized. But yeah, we haven’t weighed her, but she’s as big as a full grown cat. Look? 

CB: Wow. 

AC: And she is super squirmy right now. All right, honey. She likes her food. 

KS: She’s a good eater. 

AC: Oh, she’s —

KS: Nothing wrong with that! 

AC: — an excellent pooper as well! 

CB: When did you get Sumo? Was it in June? 

AC: So she was born middle of May, and then she arrived here couple days after the Sun entered Leo. 

CB: Okay. So that’s been a good sort of tracker of time as well – measuring this year in the past six months is like, how big your cat is getting every month. 

AC: Yeah. I expect her to be a danger to the local deer and turkey population within another six months. 

CB: Right. Well, I look forward to hearing more about their transits and what sort of things they get into over the course of 2021. 

KS: More to come. Stay tuned! 

AC: I’m sorry I don’t have any good cat astrology moments this month, but I’m sure I will in the future. 

CB: Yeah. 

AC: Like, hunting hikers, taking down whole campsites. 

CB: Right. Well, I look forward to hearing how that goes in 2021. Thanks a lot guys for joining me today for this episode of this podcast and for looking at the astrology of December. Now I’m really excited to do the year ahead forecast with you both next month, because yeah, we’ve been dealing with some heavy astrology this year, and I’m looking forward to a little bit of optimism that I think we might have for next year. So I guess we’ll have to start looking at that soon and get prepared for that forecast. 

KS: Yes. 

AC: Definitely. 

CB: Cool. All right. Well, thanks everyone for watching or listening to this episode of The Astrology Podcast. Thanks to all the patrons who support our work every month; we really appreciate it. And that’s it for this episode, so thanks for listening, and we’ll see you again next time. 

KS: Thanks everyone! 

[END CREDITS]

CB: Thanks to all the patrons that supported the production of this episode of the podcast through our page on Patreon. In particular, thanks to the patrons on our Producers tiers, including Nate Craddock, Maren Altman, Thomas Miller, Catherine Conroy, Michelle Merillat, Kristi Moe, Ariana Amour, Mandi Rae, Angelic Nambo, and Sumo Coppock. 

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Thanks also to our sponsors, including: The Northwest Astrological Conference, which is happening online May 27th through the 31st, 2021. For more information about that, visit NORWAC.net. As well as the ISAR Astrology Conference, which is happening August 18th through the 22nd, 2021; for more information, visit ISAR2020.org. The Honeycomb Collective Personal Astrological Almanac, which is available at Honeycomb.co. The Portland School of Astrology, which you can find out more information about at PortlandAstrology.org. The Astro Gold Astrology App, available at Astrogold.io. And finally, Solar Fire Astrology Software, which is available at Alabe.com, and you can get a 15% discount on it by using the promo code ‘AP15.’