The Astrology Podcast

Transcript of Episode 178, titled:

November 2018 Astrology Forecast: Jupiter in Sagittarius

With Chris Brennan and guests Austin Coppock and Kelly Surtees

Episode originally released on October 31, 2018

Original episode URL:

https://theastrologypodcast.com/2018/10/31/november-2018-astrology-forecast-jupiter-in-sagittarius/

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Note: This is a transcript of a spoken word podcast. If possible, we encourage you to listen to the audio or video version, since they include inflections that may not translate well when written out. Our transcripts are created by human transcribers, and the text may contain errors and differences from the spoken audio. If you find any errors then please send them to us by email: theastrologypodcast@gmail.com

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Transcribed by Andrea Johnson

Transcription released November 14th, 2025

Copyright © 2025 TheAstrologyPodcast.com

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CHRIS BRENNAN: Hi, my name is Chris Brennan, and you’re listening to The Astrology Podcast. Today we’re gonna be talking about the forecast for November of 2018. Joining me are Kelly Surtees and Austin Coppock. And this is Episode 177, I wanna say, of The Astrology Podcast, give or take. So welcome everybody. Thanks for joining me today, Austin and Kelly.

KELLY SURTEES: Any time.

AUSTIN COPPOCK: Our pleasure.

CB: And, yeah, so we’re doing this really quickly, as a little impromptu forecast. We’ve got a live audience of patrons who have joined us from all over the world for the recording of this episode today. If you’re watching this on YouTube, or listening to it later, I’ll have timestamps in the description for where you can jump to different parts of the episode in case you wanna skip some of the news and announcements and other stuff that we do at the beginning of the episode, as well as miscellaneous discussion topics. And then usually, in the second half of the episode, we transition into talking about the forecast. So with that out of the way, let’s start with just catching up. How are you guys doing? Kelly, you just got back from a major conference, right?

KS: I did. I had an amazing time. SOTA, which stands for State of the Art Astrology Conference, is an annual conference usually in the second half of October in Buffalo each year. Don’t be put off by the location—if you don’t think it sounds amazing—because the conference hotel is great, and the community of astrologers that goes is really amazing. We had so much fun. The caliber of speakers and presentations just seems to get better each year. And this was the largest SOTA Conference that I’ve attended. It was a larger group of people attending than I think they’ve ever had. Still quite intimate. It’s a conference that’s sort of between 150—maybe around 150 people. You know, you won’t get lost in the crowd here. So you do get that chance to have a little bit more sort of meaningful conversation and talk-time with people, and it was absolutely fantastic. So, yeah, pop it on your radar. Every year in October.

CB: Yeah, the pictures and everything from it—on social media and from the Association for Young Astrologers party—looked amazing.

KS: Yeah, I really have to give a shoutout to the Association for Young Astrologers. Jo Gleason and Jenn Zahrt were there representing that organization, and they took over the host suite. Now one of the great things about the party suite, if you like, at AFAN is it’s not a regular hotel room suite. So it’s not up on the floors with the rooms. It’s actually a separate area on the main floor of the hotel, which is private, but away from people’s bedrooms, which means you have no noise restrictions. It actually has a fully-functioning bar inside it. So you just bring in your own alcohol and beverages. And we basically had a dance party, and it was so much fun. Astrologers and attendees of all ages, just mixing and mingling over a wine or a vodka or two. And it was a great chance to kind of let our hair down and to have a lot of fun.

CB: That sounds awesome.

KS: Yeah. And as one of our wonderful listeners, Arthur, was saying, you know, at UAC, there were so many issues with all the parties getting closed down because they were just rooms on floors that had bedrooms on either side with people trying to sleep in them. So of course, you know, noise does become an issue. And that’s one of the great things about the ‘party’ room, if you like, at SOTA. So if you enjoy the social aspect of astrology conferences as much as the learning and networking, then that’s a good one to pop on your radar.

CB: Right. That sounds like a blast.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Yeah. And it’s good to hear that AYA is throwing some ragers. Cuz during my tenure, we threw a couple, and it’s a proud tradition.

KS: Yeah. And there were a lot of people. You know, the funny thing I’m realizing is every year we’ve got NORWAC at the end of May and SOTA at the end of October. They’re six months apart. They’re annual conferences, little smaller in scale. But there does seem to be a lovely crew of newer or younger astrologers coming in that are putting these conferences on their radar and making them part of their regular yearly kind of adventure schedule.

CB: Right. That’s so exciting to see. And you made a comment just before we started recording, that you’re no longer like the youngest person in the room.

KS: I was like the old person. I was like trying to keep up. I think I was talking to Franco who’s one of the astrologers out of Toronto, and he’s a little bit older still than me, and I was like, “Yeah, I’m just trying to keep up with these young ones.” So, yeah, definitely not the new kid on the block anymore, and it’s wonderful to see.

CB: Definitely. Well, hats off to Jo Gleason, who I feel like single-handedly put that conference—brought it to a new level with the promotions.

KS: Yeah, she’s done a huge—she deserves all the credit.

CB: For sure. So with that one out of the way, the next major conference, then, I believe is gonna be NORWAC. And I feel like that’s gonna be the conference of next year.

KS: Yeah.

CB: All three of us are gonna be there. Don’t know what we’re doing yet. We’re gonna do some sort of event. So I think that’s gonna be the one we’re gonna focus on in the lead-up between now and then.

KS: Yes. Yeah, I’m kind of a little—like I’m excited, but I’m a little scared for NORWAC in 2019, based on, you know, how much fun was had at SOTA. Cuz it feels like it was the warm-up for next year. So, yeah.

CB: Sure. Good times. All right. Let’s see, what other pre-show stuff do we need to get out of the way? So, Austin, what are you up to? Kelly just got back from SOTA. What have you just gotten done doing?

AC: Let’s see. So October was pretty standard reading, writing, teaching. I guess the standout is that I passed my year one practicum in my Jyotish class.

KS: Congratulations.

AC: I graduated, I think, with flying colors, with a minimum of critiques. And so, that was really fun. Basically, the assignment was do a reading for somebody using all the techniques on somebody that we didn’t know already, and then basically give a book report to the class on how the reading went and how we analyzed everything, and why we did it the way we did. And so, I didn’t even look at the chart tropical. I didn’t use any of my normal techniques. I just used the Jyotish stuff that I’ve learned this year. And I found out that I can totally do that, and it was really exciting. Because, you know, I’ve been looking at stuff, but, you know, when I look at a chart, I look at everything I know. And so, I was like, you know, “Only this.” And so, that was really exciting, and then to have that, you know, confirmed by the teacher.

CB: And this is Freedom Cole’s class, right?

AC: Yeah, this is Freedom’s Science of Light year one.

CB: Awesome. Cool.

AC: I have to say—and we’ll talk about, Chris—not only is the Parashara-style Jyotish really interesting in and of itself, but it’s given me a whole new angle on the Hellenistic techniques. Cuz there’s so much overlap, and there’s so much like, “Oh, they’re just doing this slightly different,” or “They’re doing this with this technique instead of that.” And so, it actually reignited my enthusiasm to come back to and take another look at a lot of Hellenistic things. Because it’s like, “Oh, from this angle, you can see this.” Anyway.

CB: Yeah, definitely. And there’s interesting variations. Like their variation of void-of-course. The definition of void-of-course that they use is really interesting from a Hellenistic perspective and sometimes provides insight into it. It’s like having another Hellenistic text that you didn’t know about that can give you other insight into that tradition.

AC: Yeah. That’s the, yeah, the kemadruma, which basically means ‘void of course’. Except that what they’re doing is looking at, is the Moon alone? Is the Moon totally isolated? But they’re looking at it—they’re defining ‘alone’ in a different way, but it’s the same principle of the Moon doesn’t like to be alone, right? It needs somebody to love. It needs somebody to care about. It needs to be cared about in return. It would rather have Mars or Saturn around than nobody at all. Yeah, anyway. So, yeah, it’s made me more enthusiastic about the things I already know, cuz I can see them from a different angle now.

CB: Yeah, I like that cuz—

KS: Sorry. Go, Chris.

CB: Just really quickly, the definition. In the Greek tradition, void-of-course is when the Moon is not making any applying aspects within the next 30°, and therefore, it’s isolated and there’s no planets in its path. And then, in the Indian tradition, the definition of that, that I understood, it was like somebody heard the concept and then they tried to create what the equivalent of that would be using Indian techniques and basic concepts. Do you remember offhand what the kemadruma definition is?

AC: Yeah, yeah. So, basically, you want a planet either in the sign before or after the Moon.

CB: Right. Cuz if there’s not, then it’s void-of-course.

AC: Right. Yeah, right, then it’s kemadruma. And so, in a natal chart that is considered to be canceled. If there’s a planet angular, it keeps that person from being void-of-course, if that makes sense, right? So it’s like, yeah, you know, your Moon is all alone; it’s kemadruma. But, you know, you’ve got Jupiter in the 10th, so your life is gonna be okay. It’s a cancellation. Generally, the kemadruma is a ‘poverty’ yoga, right? Which makes sense with the Moon. Like you’re unable to manifest and sustain.

KS: Yeah.

AC: But, yeah, and then there are some cancellations, but it’s a different way of looking at it. Because that 2nd house relationship—like if a planet is in the sign after the Moon—they’re looking at it more from a house perspective, where what’s in the 2nd feeds a planet.

KS: Yeah.

AC: So if something’s in the second from a planet, then there’s like, “Here’s food and money for you, Moon,” right? And then a planet that’s twelfth from the Moon, the Moon is in a 2nd house relationship to it, so the Moon has somebody to take care of and feed and cloth.

KS: And she’s happy with that. Yeah, Michael Ofek—one of his talks at UAC—was on, I think, Hellenistic considerations of the Moon, and he spoke to this idea of the Moon being alone with the 30° space either side. He was sharing the same kind of thing, Austin, that the Moon doesn’t like to be alone. And so, it’s a sad thing for the Moon if it’s gonna go 30° in either direction and won’t actually have another planet to interact with.

AC: Nobody to love.

KS: Nobody to feed or care or, you know, being needed by.

CB: Right.

AC: And from a Jyotish perspective—where the Moon is very important for characterizing a person’s mind and what their mind is on—there’s like nothing for the mind to feed. Cuz even if it’s Saturn, it’s like, “Well, I can think about security. I can think about what might happen that’s negative and then build things to avoid that.” There’s at least something for that mental energy to feed.

KS: Yeah. And we all know just from our experience with having minds that if our mind doesn’t have anything to feed or focus on, it does go a bit cray-cray.

AC: Right.

CB: Yeah, definitely. Well, and that’s part of—actually, no, that takes it in a dark direction.

KS: Give us your ‘Scorpio’, Chris.

CB: Well, it makes me think of like being in prison and solitary confinement, and how people being in solitary confinement—like that, you know, becomes almost like torture, after a certain amount of time of not having any connection with other people. And so, it’s almost that’s the extreme analogy, with like being in solitary confinement and not having any of that human interaction.

KS: Totally.

AC: I think that’s really good. Let’s assume that you’re in the middle of a longer prison sentence—which is fair—if someone’s in solitary confinement, what are you moving towards? You know, maybe freedom in 10 years? Like it’s more than 30° away, right? And then, you know, your life outside you’ve left behind long ago. And so, like there’s only this space, right?

KS: This nothingness.

AC: I think that’s a great analogy, Chris.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Yeah. That’s gonna be my new term for void-of-course, solitary confinement.

KS: Solitary confinement.

CB: Yeah. Cuz nobody knows what void-of-course means. Like everybody just repeats it. But it’s like an old, 17th century term that means ‘walking in the void’ or ‘walking in the emptiness’, which is what the Greek term, kenodromia, originally meant. It meant like ‘running in the void’ or ‘running in the emptiness’. But we get the 17th century Lilly version, which is ‘void-of-course’.

KS: I like it. That’s great.

CB: Let’s move onto our other topics. So what were our other topics for things we need to get out of news and announcements? I didn’t see a lot of news or major things this month. I mean, there’s like celebrity stuff or little, tiny—

AC: Bombings.

CB: Yeah. That was a huge thing right after the Full Moon. So the Full Moon occurred that night, and that was the big tense one that we talked a lot about last month. What were all the configurations to that? It was like Full Moon conjunct Uranus in Taurus, square Mars.

KS: And square the nodes, I guess.

AC: Yeah, the Mars square was loose. It was opposite the Moon-Venus. But, you know, the Moon was fullest conjunct Uranus within a degree or two, which is really the obvious standout. And it was square the nodes really tightly. And the Full Moon actually climaxed in the morning when all the news was coming out about that, so it was actually timed really tightly. And so, that’s one of those situations where, you know, we use words like ‘explosive’ and ‘catalytic’ for Uranus, and it was quite literal.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Yeah. So it’s like everybody woke up that morning, and then across the news—in the US, I guess—at least a bunch of different Democrats had been sent bombs in the mail, and it sparked this huge, yeah, thing. And that was like right after the Full Moon conjunct Uranus square Mars. So that was a pretty interesting manifestation of that transit.

KS: Quite literal.

CB: Yeah.

KS: Yeah. And the idea of Uranus being explosive and there being a really significant political bomb situation.

AC: Yeah. It was certainly an ‘October’ surprise.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Right.

AC: Also, the stock market’s been getting kicked in the face.

KS: Yeah.

AC: That’s not surprising.

KS: Well, no. I beg your pardon. It’s been volatile.

AC: It’s been a long time coming, you know. So we talked about—in the ‘Saturn in Capricorn’ episode—Saturn in Capricorn always beats up the United States economy every single time. And this time, with Pluto there, and with the South Node on the way, and with us being overdue for a recession, you know, the question was, is it gonna be this year or next year? It’s not like, are things gonna keep being awesome for a long time? And this is just like, you know, starting to show.

KS: It is. And October—end of October, weirdly, it’s known in stock market circles or financial circles. End of October is a more difficult time. Larger portfolios, hedge funds, stock portfolios—that type of thing—they’re often doing a lot of profit-taking at this time to, you know, kind of balance the portfolios in the lead-up to the end of the year. Yeah, I mean, this particular lunation, of course, has volatility written all over it. But to have that happening in this late October period—which is kind of known to be a little bit more of a drop time in the market—it’s an interesting correspondence.

CB: And here’s the Full Moon chart, just for anybody that wanted to picture that.

KS: Yes.

CB: Okay. And other news-type things, there’s one other thing that happened—that I think it was Jonathan Edwards pointed out to us on Twitter—is we focused a lot last month on the Venus stationing retrograde in Scorpio. And pretty close around that time one of the things that happened was the disappearance of that Saudi exile, who was a Washington Post columnist, Jamal Khashoggi. Is that how you pronounce his name?

AC: Don’t know.

KS: That’s a good approximation.

CB: Okay. The only thing that was—not the only thing. But one of the things that was interesting to me about that was one of the things that we spent a little of time talking about was Venus, and the fact that it was going retrograde in Scorpio, which is the sign opposite to its domicile. And, in my book, I had a little section talking about how the original conceptual premise underlying that was the idea of planets being opposite to their domicile, perhaps being in exile, or being like, you know, as far away from home as you can possibly get. And one of the things that I thought that was really interesting in terms of the symbolism of that story is he actually, literally, was somebody that was in exile from his home country. So it was actually a literal manifestation of the concept of exile, which is otherwise something you don’t normally think about or see very explicitly or very literally in modern times. And I’m not sure. It’s not like we have a birth time or something, so we don’t know precisely how that transit was tied into his specific chart and all the specifics. But it was interesting in terms of looking at the mundane symbolism of that Venus stationing retrograde in Scorpio around that time and what ended up happening.

AC: Well, and yeah, as I mentioned last month, on my research on the Venus retro in Scorpio, tons of famous kidnappings.

KS: Yeah.

AC: You know, that’s just something that seems to happen every eight years around this time.

KS: Yeah, and the symbolism, too. Because I believe he went into the embassy and then just didn’t come out.

CB: Right. And it was to get a wedding certificate.

KS: Oh, interesting.

CB: Or to get something in order to get married.

AC: It was something Venusian.

KS: Yeah.

CB: So from his wife’s perspective, this event in her life, it was that time that her fiancé went in to get some paperwork to the embassy. He was in exile, thought he would be okay, and then ended up being like tragically and horribly dismembered and died, basically, right around that Venus station.

KS: Well, and it’s a very violent sort of killing, too, with the reports that are coming about, you know, the attack and the dismemberment.

CB: Right.

KS: And I thought it was interesting, too, cuz when you are an exile, a place that you are led to believe would be a safe sanctuary would be something like an embassy. And we’ve had that, you know, safe port for the exile fail, basically, with, you know, horrific consequences, which is really interesting.

CB: Right. Yeah, so that was an interesting sort of ‘Venus retrograde’ story that you otherwise might not immediately jump to assuming it was a ‘Venus retrograde’ story. Did you guys have any other interesting ‘Venus retrograde-type’ stories or notable news occurrences that you noticed?

AC: Well, I mean, the getting retweeted by John Edwards was really funny.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Cuz I think I mentioned to you guys, like the night before I had restarted my monthly ancestor practice, I rebuilt my little altar, and I’d gotten photographs of my grandparents from both sides. And Kait had made some Hermanubis—which is like a Greco-Egyptian psychopomp deity, half-Hermes/half-Anubis—and like candles and oils and what not, and I was like, “Okay, I’m gonna use this and restart my ancestor practice.” And then, you know, I talked to the dead, and then I woke up being retweeted by a medium, by a famous medium. I was like, “That’s too perfect.”

CB: That’s pretty literal.

AC: Yeah.

KS: Yeah. And he’s lovely. He’s very connected to astrology.

AC: I wrote like two articles for an astrology project that he and Alan Oken did, like 8-10 years ago.

CB: Yeah, that was like 10 years ago now.

AC: Yeah, it was a long time ago. I remember I wrote something about Uranus moving into Aries.

KS: Well, that’s a while ago now. Eight years.

AC: Yeah. It was about how one of the narrative themes would be, you know, the plucky rebels versus the evil empire and how we’d see that, you know, in movies and in reality.

KS: Super interesting. Yeah, just on the ‘stock market’ piece we were talking about a few moments ago, I remember thinking the last time we had that crash—which was 2008—we had just had Pluto come into Cap, but we also had Jupiter in Capricorn at that time. And so, I think, you know, we do have Saturn and Pluto in Capricorn now. But I’m really looking to that late 2019-2020 period when Jupiter comes into Capricorn as well for, you know, if you like, corrections or depressions around global finance.

AC: Yeah. Well, you know, the eclipse cycle gets there in three months, or two months.

KS: Yeah.

AC: So we’ve got eclipses on top of Saturn and Pluto, in the Sag rising, United States, Sibley chart’s 2nd house. I think it’s gonna be a couple-year thing. I don’t think it’s gonna be one correction. I think there’s 2019 events and I think there are 2020 events as well.

CB: Yeah.

KS: Yeah.

CB: 2020 is gonna be huge. All the astrologers are talking about a lot of the alignments going on that year.

KS: Yes. We probably need to do an episode on that.

CB: Definitely. Okay, other things to get out of the way before we go. I know we had some news and announcements. For myself, the giveaways that we’re doing this month—one of them is I’ve got a box of Paula’s Daily Planetary Guide. Actually, it’s the Llewellyn Daily Planetary Guide, which I will be giving out a bunch of to patrons. So this is like a little planner and a little daily planetary guide from Llewellyn. And our good friend of the show, Paula Belluomini, did the illustrations and did a bunch of the work on this, this year. She’s taking over from another astrologer named Jim Shawvan, who had been doing it for two or three decades at this point. So those are actually available in a lot of bookstores. Because it’s Llewellyn, it’s one of the big astrology publishers that’s still left around, and so, you can find them in most bookstores, like Barnes & Noble and stuff like that. But just do a search for ‘Llewellyn Daily Planetary Guide’ for that. And I’ll give out like 5 or 10 of them to patrons this month. Let’s see, the other giveaway I’m doing this month is I finally finished my zodiac shirts, and I’ve finally got one for each sign of the zodiac. Here’s the Scorpio one.

KS: That beautiful blue.

CB: Yeah. And it’s a pretty nice, high quality, soft t-shirt. So I’m pretty excited about them. I’ve got my Aquarius rising one that I’m wearing right now. And next month I will send you guys both one. You want your Sun sign, your Moon sign, or your rising sign? What do you prefer?

KS: Just send me the one t-shirt for all three. I don’t know what Austin prefers.

AC: I would say Cancer.

CB: Cancer rising, okay. Cancer rising sign. Yeah, we could all wear our rising signs, if you feel like sharing yours publicly, Kelly.

KS: Yeah, that’s fine.

CB: That’s fine? Okay.

KS: That’s totally fine. You made a great model there, Chris.

CB: Thank you.

KS: Maybe you’ve got a second career coming, I’m sure.

CB: I need to add some pictures to Instagram of that sort of myself. I’m still trying to get some new ones. But that actually brings up the other thing I meant to announce, which is that I’ve almost finished building a podcast studio. Because I don’t have the pictures on my desktop—they’re on my phone—I’m just gonna share the Instagram page, which is a little bit of a weird way of going about doing that. But here’s some pictures I placed on the Instagram account. If people don’t know about that, you can follow The Astrology Podcast on Instagram at instagram.com/theastrologypodcast. Anyway, this is sort of what the new-ish studio is looking like for doing in-person interviews. And I’m hoping that we will, yeah, be able to start doing some interviews and having some more people out here pretty soon. I used to have a setup where, you know, people were coming through town, and I would try to throw something together, but I didn’t have a good studio for actually doing this. So this is the starting point. This is just like in my living room, and that’s why there’s like books all around it. But I’m hoping eventually to get like a dedicated studio at some point in Denver for more professional stuff, and this is the starting point.

KS: It looks very professional.

CB: Yeah, so next time you guys are in town. Hopefully, we can have you out, maybe for a workshop. I’m gonna try to figure out some way to coordinate that with my local astrology group in Denver to perhaps have people out and also do some interviews with them at the same time.

KS: That’s a great idea.

CB: Yeah. So thank you, everybody. Especially all the supporters on Patreon who have been supporting The Astrology Podcast over the past years. It’s because of that that I’m able to continue to expand and keep reinvesting in the podcast, to keep improving what I’m doing, so that makes a huge difference. Make sure—if you want to support the podcast, if you listen to us regularly—to check out our page on patreon.com and look at some of the different bonuses and different subscriber tiers, so you can get benefits if you do end up donating for the podcast each month. Do you guys have any announcements in terms of things you’re doing, that you wanna mention, before we get to the forecast this month? Austin, you’ve got a huge event. I mean, this is the November episode. So this is probably the last time to mention that, right?

AC: Yeah. So, one, I’m gonna be giving a one-off webinar on Jupiter in Sagittarius. So we’ll be doing some predictive stuff, as well as some magical stuff about how to, you know, milk that dry. Get as much Jupiter in Sag as you can because it’s not gonna last. And then I will be teaching the last unit in my fundamentals of astrology class, which is synthesis. And so, this is a little bit more workshop-y than the previous modules, which are focused on learning a piece. This is about putting together signs, planets, houses, aspects, dignity, and synodic cycles, and reading charts. And so, if you’re at that place—even if you haven’t been taking my class—you can drop in for that. And then, last but not least, during the last third of the month, I will be in Australia. Kait and I are going to Melbourne, and I’m doing a big live event with my friend and colleague, Gordon White, called So Below. And that is on Saturday, the 24th, in Melbourne. I don’t know, we’ve got 3-4—I don’t know. We’ve got like just a couple of tickets left. So, you know, if you’re in Melbourne, or if you’re going to be Melbourne and you wanna come—you’re not gonna be able to get in at the door or even next week—like grab those, cuz they’re pretty much gone. And, yeah, that should be amazing. Gordon and I are gonna talk about planetary and stellar magic, and what paradigm astrology sits in comfortably without friction. We’re gonna talk about history. It’s going to be fantastic.

KS: That sounds amazing.

CB: Yeah, that is gonna be great.

AC: It should be good. This is not clear yet. I might do a little something in Auckland, New Zealand on maybe the 1st or 2nd of December, but that hasn’t been finalized.

KS: Nice.

CB: Have you done that flight before, Austin?

AC: No. I’ve never been to Australia before. I’ve been to Europe a couple of times, but I’ve never been to Australia.

KS: Well, you know how we were talking about that kind of ‘void’ thing, when you’re like just nowhere for a long time with the Moon? That’s what flying to Australia is like.

AC: You know, I’m surprisingly comfortable in the void. I’ll just read books.

KS: No, no. Trust me, I love it. People are like, “How do you do it?” I’m like, you go up there, you have your thoughts. There’s just no internet. You know, it’s quite peaceful. It’s just kind of a long thing.

AC: Yeah—sorry. There’s one more thing I should mention, Chris, your talk with your patrons reminded me. So the event’s gonna be recorded, but it’s not gonna be put out publicly. But my patrons will get a copy of the proceedings, at least the pre-drinking proceedings of So Below. And Gordon’s premium members will get the same.

CB: Nice.

AC: It’s a little treat for the people who have supported us.

CB: That is a nice benefit. All right, Kelly, what do you have coming up?

KS: So I have actually a really full end to the year. So I’m gonna just kind of give the titles of what I’m doing, and then if people want more info, just jump over to my website or shoot me an email. I’ve got an introduction to relationship astrology class, which starts October 29. And that’s gonna run for four weeks. I’m participating in Astrology University’s astrology summit, which is all weekend. The last weekend in October, so it might be more relevant for our live listeners. But I think there are gonna be recordings available for that afterwards. I, too, am doing a Jupiter in Sag webinar. So if you want all of the ‘Jupiter in Sag’ stuff, you wanna get Austin’s webinar and get mine as well. And then, in December, I’m doing a profections two-part class online. It’s the first couple of weeks of December. And I should give a shoutout for my first annual retreat, which will be Palm Springs in January of 2019. So if you need more details on any of that, just jump onto the website or shoot me an email.

CB: And that retreat’s gonna be like a forecast for the entire year ahead, right?

KS: Yeah. We’re gonna take people through transits and progressions. So it’s sort of making sure everyone’s up to date with those techniques and then really doing some practical application about, you know, what transits or what progressions are you personally having for the year ahead. So everybody kind of gets a chance to really get a feel and a flow for what their 2019 will be about. So it’ll be two-and-a-half days. It’s right over the weekend, where we have that Leo eclipse. So we’ll be able to do a bit of stargazing on one of the evenings as well.

CB: Awesome. Well, cool. Well, people can find out more information about that on your website, which is kellysastrology.com. You can find out more for Austin’s stuff at austincoppock.com. And for the stuff I mentioned for me, go to theastrologypodcast.com/subscribe for more info about the Patreon, or theastrologypodcast.com/shop, I believe, for the shirts and other podcast merchandise. All right, guys.

KS: Excellent. Now we’ve come to the main event.

CB: I believe we have. We covered all of the main news and other things that I meant to mention. I mean, I had like some blow-off things, which are strangely all celebrity-related, even though I don’t follow celebrity news very well; the Ariana Grande and Pete Davidson breakup being a funny ‘Venus retrograde-type’ story, if anybody was following that. There was a ‘Saturn return’ story a month or two ago that I forgot to mention, that was actually really interesting, which was the rapper Machine Gun Kelly having his Saturn return in Capricorn and getting into like a feud with Eminem, with the other rapper Eminem, and that being sort of the high point—I don’t wanna say high point of his career. But suddenly coming to great notoriety when Saturn was stationing direct in Capricorn, him having Capricorn a little bit later in the sign. So if you wanna follow like an interesting developing ‘Saturn return’ story, he’s actually probably gonna be one that will be ongoing over the course of the next couple of years. Austin, you’re a big Machine Gun Kelly fan?

AC: Uh, no.

CB: I see you smiling, so I was just curious what your reaction was.

AC: Someone was making humorous comments in the comments.

CB: Oh, yeah, Arthur. All right.

KS: Who? Let’s guess.

CB: Arthur and I were just talking recently about my obsession with finding Kanye West’s birth time. I feel like it’s the ‘Moby Dick’ story of my birth data collection career, cuz I’ve gone through great lengths to find Kanye’s birth time and have met with obstacles and barriers at every turn. So we were speculating, though, that I think he has that Saturn in Leo. And there’s something about that Saturn in Leo that’s like playing a dominant role in his chart for some reason. He has no other planets in Leo, and somehow that placement is playing a much more prominent role than it should, I feel like, in his chart. And I think that’s because either he has Leo rising—and therefore, that Saturn’s in the 1st house, and it’s coloring his personality—or perhaps he has like Saturn ruling the ascendant, and it’s placed in Leo, and that’s why it’s sort of playing a more prominent role in his chart. I don’t know. You guys have any speculations about Kanye West’s birth time?

AC: Well, I think if we were gonna get into elections, we would have to find a situation that had a seriously afflicted 4th house or 4th house ruler, because his mother died really unfortunately, and his growing up was really hard.

CB: Right.

AC: And so, like those are some of the greatest struggles in his life. Possibly the greatest. And so, you know, it would have to have a gnarly 4th.

CB: Sure. Definitely.

AC: Cuz it just wouldn’t fit.

CB: Well, and he had that car accident in like 2002, which was another major event that you could use to attempt to rectify. Anyway, we don’t have to do a whole thing on that. But, yeah, I do have an obsession with different data collection and celebrity charts, and I don’t feel like there’s enough data collection sometimes of rappers’ charts. So that’s something I’ve had to try to balance out.

AC: Yeah, there’s a suggestion in the comments that somebody used Dre, which I second and third. Maybe I’ll do that.

CB: I did. I mean, it’s in my astrology book.

KS: Arthur’s saying he’s seen anyone else use it.

AC: Oh, okay.

KS: Chris did.

AC: I won’t steal Dre from you.

CB: Well, no.

AC: I do like the rapper Dr. Dre. I like him. I like the Jedi Mind Tricks and a couple of others.

CB: Cuz all of the West Coast rappers—it’s actually easy to get their birth times. Cuz if they’re born in California, California’s an open state. So we got like Dr. Dre’s birth time. We got Snoop Dogg’s birth time like 10 years ago. I remember Nick Dagan Best came up with those. There were a bunch of different famous rappers from California where it’s easy to get their birth time. I don’t think we have Kendrick Lamar yet, which is surprising, cuz I think he was born in Compton. So that would be another one to look up. Are there any life famous birth times that you guys have always wanted, that you’ve never been able to get a hold of?

AC: Mostly authors for me.

CB: Authors.

KS: Yeah, I mean, I’m obsessed—as I’ve shared with guys in the pre-show chat—with the movie, A Star is Born, at the moment. And I just realized we don’t have an exact birth time for Lady Gaga, so I’d like one of those. And I would also like a birth time for Princess Catherine/Duchess Middleton, whatever her official name is. The one who married William. I’d like a birth time for her.

CB: Oh, right, Catherine.

KS: Yeah.

CB: We have Harry’s wife.

KS: We have Meghan Markle, yeah. Yeah, we have Meghan Markle. Her chart seemed to be readily available, and so, we’ve got hers. And they’re pregnant. So I’m happy that my profection prediction has been borne out there based on Harry’s chart.

AC: Oh, well done.

KS: Yeah, so Harry was in this massive 10th house year by profection, I think, and it’s a very strong Venus, which also ruled the 5th. And I was like, “I’m sure we’re gonna get a baby announcement.” I think what I said was, “He’ll be pregnant before his next birthday.” And they didn’t announce it publicly until after the birthday, but they must have fallen pregnant, you know, in that profection year for them to be as far along as they are.

AC: That has to come first, right?

KS: Correct. And, you know, they’re actually on tour. They’re doing a South Pacific tour right now. So they’ve been in Australia. They’ve been in Fiji. So all the Australian news press that I’m still in touch with is full of, you know, Harry and Meghan. And they announced it, you know. Of course they never say the exact due date, but the expectation originally was that they must have been about three months along when they announced it. But Meghan had a private conversation with another Australian, who commented about it on her Instagram feed, that she talked about actually being four months along. And actually John Edwards and I—funnily, you mention him, Austin. If he’s listening to this episode, he’s getting so many shoutouts.

AC: Hey, John.

KS: He and I had had some Twitter banter about, you know, how quickly the baby announcement would come. I think he and I both thought they would fall pregnant in July or August, which it turned out is what they did. Oh, you can see his chart right there. Can you put it up?

CB: Yeah.

KS: He’s just got this really ‘golden’ Venus in the 10th house in Libra, and it was turned on by profection. And in that 12 months, he announced his engagement, got married, and got pregnant.

CB: Right. I love that. Even just Venus in and of itself and having such a prominent and well-placed Venus in Libra in the tenth whole sign house, and being in that 10th house profection year, and just having his marriage as like the center and focal point of the year was really interesting.

KS: Yeah. And to a female figure who had her own sort of status or celebrity of sorts as well. Yeah, because obviously their wedding was a hugely public event.

AC: But, yeah, Chris, I think the point that you were pointing to is that sometimes the planetary significations of an annual profection will outshine some of the house ones. Cuz some profections, it’s just like, oh, it’s 3rd house profection, ‘3rd house’ stuff happens. Whereas when you have, you know, a 10th house Venus in Libra, and that’s activated, it’s just Venus, right? You know, the Venus outshines the 10th.

CB: Yeah.

KS: Yes. I mean, it wasn’t like he did a ‘Venus’ thing in his career necessarily. He just did a ‘Venus’ thing. Or he did a series of ‘Venus’ things.

AC: I’m sure. I’m sure it took a couple of tries.

KS: Oh, I love it. And we haven’t even had drinks, so that’s great.

AC: No. No drinks for me in October.

KS: That’s right.

CB: What would that actually be like? We should try that sometime, like after hours, The Astrology Podcast episode at one of these conferences.

KS: Oh, my God. Totally. I’ll pour the drinks. I’m clearly capable of this after last weekend’s showing at SOTA.

AC: Oh, speaking of after hours, semi-drunken conversations, I think I’m actually gonna be ready to release the first episode of my little podcast project I think before the end of October.

KS: Excellent.

CB: Nice.

AC: Yeah. I didn’t get drunk. You know, the whole idea was to capture or eavesdrop on the ‘2:00 AM conversation’. And so, the first episode is my friend and longtime smith Tony Mack, who’s a good astrologer and is a jeweler and smith who’s been making little astro-magic talismans. We’ve been doing projects together since 2010. He’s sort of a ‘secret’ weapon, and so, I thought it would be fun to have a talk with him. Cuz people know him, but they haven’t had a chance to sit down with him.

CB: I love Tony. I just found this yesterday, a little Mercury talisman that he made for me like several years ago.

KS: Fantastic.

AC: Do you remember the election?

CB: Yeah. It was like a Virgo rising, Mercury in Virgo election that I picked out years ago, and he made the talisman for me at that time. It was kind of an experiment. And the results were a little bit mixed. It wasn’t like a great chart for me. It brought up a lot of questions about charts being objectively good elections, let’s say, or even magic elections versus how the chart relates to the individual.

AC: Right. Cuz that’s your 8th, yeah?

CB: Yeah, yeah. Right. So that’s a little tricky. But I like his work. He’s a great, you know, person who makes those things.

AC: Yeah, he’s good. We’ve done a bunch of experiments.

CB: So is that podcast gonna be on your website, austincoppock.com?

AC: Yeah. I will ring the bells that still can ring and let people know.

CB: Sure. All right. Brilliant. And for profections—since we were just mentioning that a lot—for those that aren’t familiar with that technique, check out Episode 153 of The Astrology Podcast where I did like a two-hour workshop on that, if you wanna learn more about profections. Or check out Kelly’s upcoming workshops, which will be happening in a few months, where you’re doing a two-part series on that, you said, right?

KS: Yes. Yeah, looking at what annual profections are and then working with the time-lord and the solar return charts. So that’ll be fun.

CB: Brilliant. All right. So those were all of the celebrity things that I wanted to mention. Yeah, let’s get into the forecast.

KS: Yeah.

CB: I think it’s well past time.

KS: It’s totally ‘forecast’ time.

AC: Yeah.

CB: All right. Let me pull up the chart for right now, for those who are watching the video version. And what are we starting with this month, chronologically?

KS: November 6.

AC: Yeah. And let’s just say the month comes in much differently than it goes out. Beginning and end are totally different vibes. There’s really like a part one, middle, and part three that are very distinct. This isn’t like, you know, last month. We had sort of a one-vibe month.

KS: Yeah, this is not like that.

AC: Yeah. You know, this has got like a three-act structure.

KS: I like that summary of this month, for sure, for sure. All the ‘Jupiter’ vibes by the end of the month.

AC: I know. I will be lost on the other side of the world and loving it.

KS: I mean, we were talking about, you know, all the comments in the webinar chat for live listeners around, you know, the drinking. Somebody said: “Drink like a trio of people with water stelliums.” And it just made me think of the Mars-Jupiter square coming up at the end of November, which we’ll get to. But Mars will be in Pisces and Jupiter will be early in Sag.

CB: Or the Mercury-Neptune square. That was like a huge thing. Leisa was having problems with elections this month, that Mercury’s stationing retrograde square Neptune.

KS: Yeah.

CB: So it’s pretty much there most of the month.

KS: It’s there for a good part of the middle of the month, yeah.

CB: Yeah. And we’ve got the Jupiter ingress into Sagittarius finally. So we’re saying goodbye to our year of Jupiter in Scorpio, very sadly. Moving into a year of—

KS: I had a client this week say they cannot wait to see the back of Jupiter in Scorpio. So I feel like the Jupiter in Scorpio is personal preference or not.

CB: Yeah. I wanted to get more out of it. I wanted to squeeze more out of it than I did over the course of the past year, having a Scorpio stellium myself. But I guess it was still pretty good in the ‘growth and expansion’ department.

KS: Yeah, I remember last time Jupiter was in Sag. I had a very golden period, so I’ve certainly been biased towards that. And then the other huge thing this month—Mars finally getting the hell out of Aquarius.

CB: Yeah.

AC: And Venus stations direct.

KS: And those two things happen in the middle of the month. November 15-November 16. Anyway, we’re totally bouncing around, Chris. Do you wanna do this chronologically?

CB: No, I think that’s good. I did wanna do a little bit of an overview of just mentioning a few of the things that we’re gonna touch on. Cuz that kind of highlights just the fact that there’s a lot of important shifts going on this month.

AC: Yeah. I mean, just super quick overview, first half, Venus, second half, Mercury and Jupiter.

KS: That’s a good way of summarizing it. And, yeah, at a meta perspective, what I’ve been saying, you know, to my monthly subscribers and for clients and things like that is there are so many things changing—changing signs or changing direction in November—that it does feel like, you know, there’s fresh air coming in and situations are evolving. We’re not stuck anymore. I think particularly with Jupiter going into Sag and Mars going into Pisces, there’s movement here. You know, places that have been really kind of you’ve had to bend down—you know, from fixed to mutable, it’s definitely more mobile. Maybe a bit scattered, sure. Mutable has gotta cop that. But definitely a lot more movement. Venus ending her retrograde. I know Mercury’s gonna go retrograde, but it’s not that it’s nothing. But I feel like, yeah, Mercury’s retrograde, but Mars and Jupiter are on the move, Venus is ending her retrograde. Those things are sort of more overrides in my book, I guess.

CB: Yeah, definitely. So in terms of—like where do you guys wanna start for the beginning of this month?

KS: November 6.

CB: November 6, okay. So we’ll jump forward.

KS: Do you wanna start there, Austin? Nodes changing signs? Uranus changing signs?

AC: Well, let’s just say that, you know, on the last day of October, Venus retrogrades back into Libra. And so, Venus will be in Libra on the 1st of November, all the way to the end.

KS: Yes.

AC: And so, that’s a very different vibe from Venus in Scorpio, right? Venus was in Scorpio for all of October, right? And so, we talked abundantly about Venus in Scorpio. I believe I provided some good, ‘dark forest/sewage’ metaphors last month.

KS: You did. Which were very popular on Twitter. But you’re right. We should give Venus in Libra her due.

AC: Yeah. I mean, we’ve got a Venus station in the sign that Venus rules.

KS: Yeah.

AC: And, you know, what’s kind of fun about that is that, you know, that station—it’s in Libra both sidereally and tropically. You know, everyone agrees that’s a Venus station in Libra.

KS: Which is nice, cuz there isn’t always that agreement.

AC: No. About 5/6 of the time there isn’t.

KS: There isn’t. So, I mean, Austin, you did give some beautiful images. I mean, I know I talked about compost, and you were talking about sewage for Venus in Scorpio. What are you talking about for Venus in Libra?

AC: So, you know, with Venus in Libra, you know, we have Venus stationing. We have Venus arising again in the east, after the underworld ideal—ordeal in Scorpio.

KS: That’s a nice wordplay.

AC: Yeah. And so, you know, when Venus rises in the east, the ‘morning star’ Venus is much more active, outgoing; some texts say masculine or assertive. You know, this is Venus seeking justice. This is Venus going out and creating the right relationship, trying to create harmony, right? Whereas ‘evening’ rising Venus and Mercury—they’re more receptive, mellow, adaptive, but this is a fresh rising and station. And so, you know, you really have something not unlike the image of Justice herself, like winged, with scales, you know, after a long time of like looking at what’s balanced and what’s unbalanced. And that’s internal to feeling. Like feeling the bad and feeling the good and not knowing how to reconcile them. You know, this is a going forth and creating balance. Creating equilibrium. Creating fairness. Creating harmony. And so, by the time we get to the middle of the month, it’s very active. It’s an increasingly active Venus all month.

KS: Yeah. And you make some beautiful points there about the independence quality of a ‘morning star’ Venus. You know, ‘morning star’ Venus is not as maybe partnership-oriented as the ‘evening star’ Venus is. And so, even though we’re in the sign of Libra, that ‘morning star’ quality is definitely mixing things up a bit. I like, also, what you said there around it’s almost like, you know, we’re refocusing on the future. How can we sort of move forward with these intentions about right balance and integrity? And I also can’t help but think, you know, Venus stations direct right near Spica, one of the really potent fixed stars in the sky, which is at 24 Libra. And Venus stations direct at 25 Libra. And our Spica is a very bright fixed star that is quite close to the ecliptic, and it represents the potential for brilliance. Traditionally, it was sort of viewed as the knowledge or the wisdom of agriculture, which was, you know, historically, very valuable information. And what it tends to be associated with today is those ideas or innovations that can really lead to growth and progress for culture and society. So I do think there’s a lot of symbolism in this Venus station based on, you know, the things we’ve mentioned here today.

AC: Yeah, that point about Spica’s really important. So Spica, by the way, is actually the star that anchors the most popular ayanamsa used to convert between sidereal and tropical, cuz it’s really close to the ecliptic.

KS: Right.

CB: You’re talking about Lahiri?

AC: Yeah.

KS: Yeah.

AC: And so, what was I gonna say about Spica, though? Right—Bernadette Brady says that it’s basically indeterminate brilliance. It’s sort of like it can be brilliance in any field. It’s not this or that. It just adds that capacity for brilliance to whatever planet it’s next to.

KS: Yeah.

AC: And then in the nakshatras, Spica anchors a mansion, which is called Chitra, which is like ‘the shining jewel’ which is Spica. And Spica’s specifically oriented to brilliance of design. The deity that’s associated with it is like the celestial or the heavenly architect designer. It’s that that light, Spica’s light, illuminates like the deep structure of how to make things, how to design things, whether they’re social systems or, you know, mechanical devices or a piece of art or whatever. But, Kelly, like you said, it’s brilliance.

KS: It is brilliance. And I think you said it beautifully. It’s almost like a bonifying energy, where it enhances or amplifies anything that’s near it. And so, we’re going to have, you know, Venus station direct, right near Spica. I don’t know. I feel like there’s an extra special sort of emergence or revelation that can come out of this Venus station, if we can have people picking up that ‘Spica’ blessing at the same time.

AC: Right, right. Well, in terms of ‘morning star’ Venus being more active or assertive, you know, how do you create harmonious arrangements? How do you create justice? How do you create beauty, right? Not how do you receive, but how do you design these things, right? How do you design them in your relationships? How do you design them in your work?

KS: A hundred-percent, a hundred percent. And I think this is great because—for our listeners who have been listening to our podcast for a while—this is a much more positive take on Venus this month than what we had necessarily last month. Or at least the imagery has more lightness in it. It has maybe something subjectively good that we might be able to get out of Venus this month, even as she wraps up this retrograde.

AC: And I would say that, you know, the power Venus has—that’s going to be experienced as positive at this, you know, direct station point—is the power accumulated and only made possible by, you know, the going through the sewers in Scorpio in retrograde and deeply combust, you know. There’s the gathering of power from the underworld and then the emerging, you know. Just in a simple, like mythical narrative format, the hero or heroine goes into the underworld, they experience an ordeal. They leave something there.

KS: Find the treasure.

AC: But then they get something, you know, an exchange for, you know, the ordeal. They come out with something that they couldn’t have gotten anywhere else, right? In terms of the, you know, conjoining the Sun and being combust, metaphorically, a planet goes through purification by fire when it’s combust. So we’ve got Venus purified by flame. You know, we’ve got the trash piles that’ve been burnt away, and there was literally a Chitra or a Spica—there’s a jewel somewhere in the ashes—and Venus emerges with that gem glowing more brilliant everyday.

CB: And we actually reached that halfway point, that darkest point, today, this morning, October 26, which was the Sun-Venus conjunction, with Venus retrograde hitting the Sun at 3° of Scorpio. And then this Venus station that we’re talking about in the middle of October is the other end of that.

AC: Yep, exactly. Yeah, we were talking not too far before the retrograde station before, and everybody could feel the descent starting, the ‘call of the sewers’. And then we got pulled down, and we’ve been, you know, hanging out at the bottom. And soon the rise begins.

KS: Yeah. Yeah, I’m just thinking of a song, again, from A Star is Born. That will be all my imagery for anyone that I can offer, but the music from that film is great. But one of the lines in the songs is: “I’m at the bottom of the bottle.” And I think that was the Venus in Scorpio, like we’re at the bottom.

CB: One of the things I want to mention with this station of Venus at 25° of Libra, around November 15, is that it went into its shadow. It actually first passed over that degree way back around September 3, I believe, when it passed 25° of Libra originally. So it’s retrograding back and it’s returning back to a degree that it crossed previously. And sometimes in a timing sense this ends up connecting two different periods. Or it ends up connecting events that take place in those two different times because a planet is returning back to the same degree. And there was actually a really striking example of this that Leisa Schaim noticed this past month with Mars and the Mars retrograde cycle, where she pointed out that the Supreme Court seat went vacant the day that Mars stationed retrograde earlier this year, several months ago.

AC: I did not know that. That’s super interesting.

KS: Yeah.

CB: And that it ended up being filled the same weekend that Mars returned back to that same degree. So the Supreme Court seat was announced to be vacated and that there was an opening when Mars first stationed there. And then when it came back, when Mars returned back to and then recrossed that same path for the final time, that was when, eventually, Brett Kavanaugh was confirmed as a Supreme Court justice.

AC: Oh, wow.

CB: That’s a really super, super important example—not the specifics—but to generalize that, that’s sometimes how retrograde degrees and shadow degrees work. They can connect events in different parts of either a few-months’ time-span or in terms of an entire year. And it works not just with inner planets, but sometimes it also works with outer planets like Saturn as well, which you’ll see connecting periods that are very far apart, like several months apart.

AC: Yeah, that’s a nice one.

KS: Yeah.

AC: I mean, it’s not nice in terms of I’m not pleased with the outcome of that event. But as far as an example goes, that’s quite good.

KS: The symbolism, yeah. So what you’re really saying, Chris, is early September and mid-November are connected by Venus hitting that 25-degree mark of Libra. And so, people could think about events from, potentially, early September and some sort of resolution or completion coming through around the station in the middle of November.

CB: Yeah. For some people, it’s gonna be something that started or was initiated in early September will be brought to completion or will come to some sort of conclusion. You’ll have to revisit it, but it’ll be brought to conclusion in the middle of November, when Venus returns back to that degree and then stations direct. Because it’s revisiting something, but it’s revisiting it in order to bring completion before then finally moving on.

KS: That’s really useful for people to think about. I mean, that’s the wonderful thing in astrology, isn’t it? That we can link these seemingly random or disconnected periods of time through the cycles of the planet.

CB: Yeah. Well, it’s also hard, though, because that’s one of the most fascinating things in astrology, with the shadow degrees and retrograde stations and returning to those. But it’s also one of the hard things to study. Because sometimes the events that it’s connecting are subtle, or you don’t immediately notice them, or you may not be aware of them, especially if you’re studying it from like the outside, with like a celebrity case. Whereas sometimes if you’re following your own chart, you can connect those events and realize—if you pay attention—you know, if you see an important event happening for you when the planet’s stationing direct, sometimes going back and looking at when it first passed that same shadow degree, you’ll see the event that led up to it, that you didn’t realize at the time was significant, or that you are only realizing in retrospect what significance that would end up having.

KS: That’s true.

AC: Yeah, absolutely.

CB: Sure. So that’s the Venus direct station. I mean, the last thing that’s weird about this Venus station, though—and you guys have said some very positive and great things about it, which I like—but Uranus ingressing or making its retrograde ingress back into Aries is one of the other features of this month. And it looks like Uranus moves from Taurus back into Aries around November 5-November 6.

AC: So I wanna pause us there, because the 6th-8th, we get three big changes. Well, we get four important things really quickly on Venus’ way to becoming direct.

CB: Right.

AC: Kelly, you’re with me on this?

KS: Yeah, I’m definitely with you on at least three of the four. So, yeah.

CB: Okay. Well, let’s do those then. Cuz I just wanted to mention that, because that opposition with Uranus, I feel like, really offsets some of the things going on with that Venus station in late Libra, because it’s so closely opposing Uranus at the same time.

KS: Yeah. The Venus-Uranus opposition peaks on November 30, when they come exact by degree. So that is out there at the end of the month. But I guess I’m just sort of thinking Venus has got a little bit of time to pull some stuff forward before she gets, you know, right into the clutches of Uranus.

AC: I would say that it’s just active as soon as Uranus goes into Aries.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Like it matters when it’s by degree, but the opposition’s within a couple of degrees almost the whole month.

KS: Yeah, that’s true.

CB: Sure. And I guess that’s the only reason I was mentioning it. But then you’re probably right, Kelly, that that’s not gonna fully culminate, perhaps, until later in the month, when they have their final opposition.

KS: Yeah. And I have a little bias. I mean, I don’t wanna sound like I’m dismissing outer planet transits or what have you, but Venus has a lot of strength in Libra. You know, she’s in one of her home signs at the moment. You know, she’s got a little bit of distance from the Sun. So I think she’s sort of recovering her resources to sort of take whatever Uranus is bringing to her. And, yep, she’s gonna have to do ‘Uranus’ stuff. She’s gonna have to break with convention or, you know, break her own habits or tendencies, but it can actually lead to either a welcome or a productive outcome.

CB: Like liberation or something.

KS: Yeah.

AC: I have a very similar feeling, Kelly. Like I feel like Venus is so strong here. Venus is going to be incorporating Uranus rather than them sort of being on equal footing.

KS: Doing something to her, kind of thing.

AC: Yeah. The Venus direct action, the Venus direct-and-arising action, is going to incorporate and have more ‘Uranian’ things. Like, for example, during the time that Venus is opposite Uranus, I will be having a super good time with a lot of people: Venus super strong in Libra; but Uranus, on the other side of the world, in a place I’ve never been before.

KS: Yeah, yeah.

AC: Which that’s Uranian.

KS: You’re way outside your comfort zone. You think I sound strange. You’re gonna have to wait to hear what these people are gonna throw at you down there. It’s gonna be funny.

CB: Well, and I guess we have to contrast so much of it with Venus having coming out of the first half of its retrograde station in Scorpio, and being much less naturally affiliated with that sign, or having much less in common with that sign naturally than it does this one. So this would probably be seen as a shift, as an improvement, at least in terms of Venus’ natural significations. And therefore, what you guys are saying is that Uranus opposition is probably gonna lend more on the side of the liberating-type, empowering-type significations in terms of Venus’ station rather than just pure destabilization. Which is probably also true because it’s stationing direct at this point. And usually there’s some sort of reconciliation, or there’s some sort of like remediating aspect of the direct station versus the retrograde one, where you’re just going into some of the problems and challenges and setbacks.

AC: Yeah. I mean, the energy of the retrograde station is literally a sinking down. You’ll see Venus get lower in the sky in the west everyday until it disappears, whereas, you know, the motion, the apparent motion of Venus during the period surrounding the direct station is literally a rising up, you know. And so, yeah, there’s a huge difference there. And like you said, Chris, we were talking about, with Venus in Scorpio, Venus in exile, and now we talk about Venus coming to, you know, her fortress of strength, right?

CB: Right.

AC: Coming home.

CB: Coming home, yeah. ‘Home’ is really good. There was an astrologer a few years ago, at an OPA retreat, and she was originally Greek. She was a modern astrologer, but she said, “I like when you use the most traditional terms, because I relate to them immediately.” And she just talked about domicile, except she kept calling it like ‘a planet being at home’, which is, when we talk about the metaphors, usually what we associate with it. We talk about it being in its home or its dwelling place. But just that idea of home, and using that specific term, invokes a lot of meanings and like related concepts that are probably much more closely and directly, you know, things that you can relate to, that are tangible and useful rather than the more abstract; when we use concepts like ‘domicile’ or what have you.

AC: I mean, the term, you know, people just knew what domicile meant. It literally means ‘your home’. It’s where you dwell, right?

CB: Well, and we’re using ‘domicile’, honestly, I think, primarily cuz we can’t use the term ‘house’, because that’s become conflated with—

KS: Conflicted with the house system.

CB: The ‘house system’ thing, which is a whole mess up that happened at one point.

AC: Oh, you mean the place system?

CB: The places? Yeah. They were originally called places.

AC: The big ‘place system’ debate.

CB: Right.

KS: What’s your place system? It sounds like setting the table for Thanksgiving or something.

AC: Yeah. Do you use Placidus?

KS: That was good, Austin.

AC: Thanks.

CB: Yeah. So we would say ‘home’ probably or something like that, or ‘house’, but we can’t, because of the house system issues, so we say ‘domicile’. But then it becomes almost more abstract or more removed from the actual conceptual idea that we’re trying to get to.

KS: Yeah. Cuz you’re right. The explanation of a planet being in its own sign—it’s like being in your own home, where you’ve got access to all your favorite things, and the food you like is in the refrigerator, and your comfy sheets or pillow or your cat that cuddles you or whatever it happens to be.

CB: Sure. So a possible title of this is ‘Venus Coming Home This Month’.

KS: Yes! Venus is at home. Totally.

AC: Well, I titled my piece on most of this, “Ordeal and Ascent.”

CB: Okay.

KS: Of course you did.

AC: Whatever. It ends on ascent. Ascent is a happy note.

KS: Yes. Ordeal and ascent?

AC: Yeah.

KS: Okay, right. I beg your pardon. I misheard.

AC: We did the descent, you know, last month.

KS: And the ascent is really important. Like the visual is Venus starting to rise in the east. And the Venus ‘morning star’ is incredibly independent. She is the ‘Venus’ warrior energy, if you like. So there is a little strength to that.

AC: Yeah, I’m a Venus ‘morning star’. What about you, Kelly?

KS: Of course, of course.

AC: You have to be. We both are.

KS: Of course we are.

AC: And Chris is an ‘evening’ Venus.

KS: Okay.

CB: Yeah. Everything in my chart’s on the other side of the Sun, so it’s all evening.

KS: Yeah. Okay, interesting. I think, Austin, if I remember, we have Venus quite far from the Sun.

AC: Yeah, I think we’re pretty near maximum elongation.

KS: Yes, yes, we are.

AC: Mine’s like 43°.

KS: 36. Yeah, mine’s like 41, maybe, off the top of my head.

AC: Yeah, I think it is. That’s getting pretty close.

KS: It is close. She’s very bright. I think, Austin, we have Mercury as ‘evening star’.

AC: Yeah. I was born like 10 days before the retrograde station.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Right.

KS: We’re totally like riffing at fairly advanced stuff that maybe not everyone will be following. Let’s get back to November 6-8, which is when Austin and I are really excited about.

CB: Yeah. So what do you guys wanna focus on? So I see Uranus changing signs. It moves from 0° of Taurus to 29° of Aries.

KS: Yeah. The nodes. North Node slipping into Cancer the same day. 0 Leo to 29 Cancer.

CB: This is the true nodes, correct?

AC: I believe the mean also moves.

CB: Is it that close?

KS: That’s a very good question.

AC: Let me just—why don’t you guys talk. I’ll just double-check that real quick.

KS: Okay, thank you, fact checker.

CB: I’m pretty sure I have it set on the true nodes in my software. So it’s November 5-November 6, the South Node moves from Aquarius to Capricorn, and the North Node moves from Leo to Cancer, since the nodes, of course, move backwards through the signs. And one of the things that we’ll start seeing then—that we’ve already started to see a little bit, but especially from this point forward, now that the nodes are switching into Cancer and Capricorn—is we’ll start seeing eclipses take place in those two signs, because the nodes represent the point where the path of the Sun and Moon intersect each other. And when the Sun and Moon intersect each other, we have not just New Moons and Full Moons, but we also have eclipses.

AC: Okay, so real quick, I checked it. So the mean nodes move on the 15th-16th.

KS: Okay.

AC: So right on the Venus station. So it’s about a 10-day gap—

KS: A 10-day delay.

AC: Between the true and mean.

KS: I had this question somebody asked me at the conference last weekend, did I use the true or the mean node. And I was pretty sure I was using the true node, so I can confirm that. And it sounds like you are too, Chris. What about you, Austin? Are you a ‘true node’ guy?

CB: I mean, I am. But I don’t honestly have a strong opinion either way.

KS: Okay. Austin?

AC: I don’t have a strong opinion either way. That’s where I’m at.

KS: Okay, cool. I like it, great. So I didn’t feel bad for having a more precise answer then. My response was, “Well, I figured I might as well just do the true, cuz then it’s a little bit more exact.”

CB: Yeah. I mean, I’ve only had like one real instance. Cuz usually this is something you probably try to figure out with like transits or something like that. But I’ve only seen one instance that really struck me as interesting, that made me lean towards the true nodes one time, when I was watching somebody else’s chart. And I think it was like Paul Ryan in the 2012 presidential election. He was the vice presidential candidate. And at the Republican National Convention, there was a group of astrologers who watched both the RNC and the DNC, so we could write down times when everybody did their speeches and accepted things. And he got up and he gave his on the last night of the convention and it was a pretty big deal for him politically, subjectively. And the node like shifted signs right at that moment when he finished his speech, or around that time, which was weird because it was right on his ascendant, at like 0° of that sign. So the node moved right off of it right after he finished his speech, and that was using the true node. And that was one of the things that, just trying to study transits, pushed me more towards the true node than the mean node.

KS: Beautiful.

CB: Yeah.

AC: The nodes move in November.

KS: Yes, exactly. I was gonna say that. Yeah, whether you’re using true or mean, they’re both changing signs.

AC: And so, that sets us up for a year-and-a-half of Cancer/Capricorn eclipses. We have one more Leo eclipse. But other than that, it’s all Capricorn and Cancer for quite some time. And so, that means this is, you know, the foreshadowing of the eclipse axis moving onto Saturn and Pluto as they too draw nearer.

CB: Right.

AC: And so, that is going to be a very intense eclipse series.

CB: So that’s the other thing that’s setting up the ‘2020’ stuff.

KS: Yeah.

AC: You know, just a brief aside about the month as a whole, including the shift. By the end of this month, things look a lot like 2019. In some ways, I feel like 2018’s big stories really finish up in November. Cuz the whole thing has been, you know, what’s 2018 been about? It’s been about Uranus moving into Taurus; that’s gonna be over. It’s been about the eclipses in Leo and Aquarius; that’s more or less over. And it’s been about these tightly-interlocked Venus and Mars retrogrades, which were both interlocked with each other, stationing roughly 90° away from each other; and both of them were angular to Uranus. And so, by the time we get to the end, Jupiter’s been in Scorpio for all of 2018. And so, by the time we get to the end of November, you know, 2019 comes early. Like those are the skies we’re gonna be looking at for a lot of 2019.

KS: Yeah, that’s a really good point, Austin. Because Jupiter is moving into Sag, which is November 8, we then have that running through until early December of 2019. So it’s basically the vibe. I really like how you put that. The ‘2018’ theme is a kind of wrapping up.

AC: Thank God.

KS: And that’s what I mean. I’m so excited about November, because I’m really done with Mars in Aquarius. And more than anything, I’m so done with that. I’m very happy to have Jupiter move into Sag, but just to get Mars out of Aquarius. I just want something different from Mars.

CB: Yeah, I really feel like that’s the end of the retrograde cycle. Even though we’ve passed the shadow degree, we’ve long passed, you know, Mars stationing direct, but it’s still in the same sign that it’s been in for most of the year until later in November, when Mars finally moves into Pisces, what? November 15.

AC: Yeah.

KS: Yes.

AC: Within like 12 hours before Venus goes into direct.

KS: Yeah.

AC: But just to jump back to 6th through the 8th, so we have Uranus regresses back into Aries, right? So Uranus was in Aries—it jumped in, in 2010, and then it moved in, I think, March 11, 2011. And then Uranus was in Aries from March of 2011 up until May of 2018, earlier this year, when it made an ingress into Taurus. And so, on November 6 this year, Uranus will drop back into Aries for almost exactly four months to finish up that old cycle, and then will return to Taurus and stay there until 2025. I know that it’s exactly four months, because it moves back into Taurus on my birthday, March 5.

CB: So this is it. This is the very last of Uranus in Aries. And we’re finally closing out what has been the greater part of a decade of Uranus transiting through Aries, with one last reminder and one last dip of that planet back into that previous sign.

AC: Yep. So people with planets in very late cardinal, you’re gonna get one more shot of Uranus in Aries.

KS: Yeah.

AC: And then the same day, nodes move. We just talked about that. That’s about a year-and-a-half. Then we have the New Moon in Scorpio, and then like 12 hours later, Jupiter moves into Sag.

KS: Yeah.

AC: So that’s a lot of shifts for, you know, three days.

KS: It’s huge. It really is a huge amount of energy. The other thing I like—I agree completely, Austin. When I’ve looked at the month ahead, I had a feeling of like a ‘breakthrough’ vibe. And we say, very last degrees of cardinal, Uranus only comes back to 28 Aries. So it’s literally 28° and 29° of the cardinal signs that get the exact degree-based hits, but, you know, thereabouts. And on those two days, interestingly, after the New Moon, the Moon comes into Sag shortly after Jupiter comes into Sag. So there’s like an ushering. You know, the Moon is there as Jupiter crosses the threshold, basically.

AC: Yeah. It’s like less than 24 hours after Jupiter ingresses, the Moon conjoins Jupiter at 0 Sag on a Thursday, the day of Jupiter.

KS: Yes.

CB: You know, and that’s gonna be almost exactly 15° away from the Sun. So that might be even visible right after sunset.

KS: That’s actually a really good point. Yeah, it’s right on the phasis point.

AC: Yeah. It’s gonna be like just barely visible for a little bit.

KS: Tiny sliver if you’ve got clear skies like for the first half-hour or so after sunset, maybe.

AC: Yeah. Well, and Jupiter’s really dim right now. So just one thing. I know there are a lot of people who are excited about Jupiter in Sag, and I am one of them, but this is one of the things you see with a lot of the recent Jupiter ingresses. Jupiter ingresses into a sign just as it goes under the beams and then into combustion. You know, Jupiter is basically doing a less-intense version of what Venus just did—disappearing in the west and then reappearing in the east. Doesn’t take as long, it’s not as gnarly, but you’re not really gonna be able to drink from the cup of Jupiter in Sag until Jupiter reemerges in the east.

CB: That’s weird that it disappears like right then, right as it’s moving into its own sign.

AC: Yeah, it did that last year, too.

KS: Yeah, it did.

AC: I don’t know if that’s every year. It probably shifts a little bit. But, anyway, I don’t know, but it’s definitely doing that. So, you know, you’ll probably feel a little ‘Jupiter in Sag’ shift. But for things to really get moving, you need the Sun 15° on the other side of it.

KS: Yeah.

CB: I think that’s gonna be my title, maybe, for this episode, ‘Venus and Jupiter Coming Home’, because they’re both basically doing it this month.

AC: Yeah, yeah.

KS: Yes.

AC: Benefics in domicile.

CB: Nice.

KS: Also, a stellar signature for November just to have that, given everything we’ve dealt with this year so far.

AC: So maybe we’ll do like a special episode, maybe not. But let’s just talk a little bit about Jupiter in Scorp versus Jupiter in Sag, maybe. Yeah?

CB: Sure.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Let’s do a retrospective first. I mean, one of the things—I don’t know. I mean, one of the big things of course that happened late last year—cuz it was right after Jupiter went into Scorpio—suddenly everything started coming out about the MeToo movement. And it all started with the director, Weinstein. Harvey Weinstein, right?

KS: Yes.

CB: What was the end result of that? Like it was interesting, cuz it was actually in the past two weeks I think I saw a retrospective in The Washington Post or something where it was trying to talk about what impact that ended up having in showing up in different countries. Cuz one of the objections that I remember late last year—some people were annoyed that astrologers were focusing on this and associating it with Jupiter in Scorpio and treating it almost like it was just an ‘American’ phenomenon. But then it did seem like it started having a broader impact, and it was showing up in other countries over the course of the past 12 months, it seems like, right? It may not have completely changed the world in terms of making things completely different than they were 12 months ago. But it seems like a lot of conversations were started that weren’t taking place like a year ago, right?

KS: I would agree with that. Just trying to think about—yeah.

AC: Well, so just to include that in a more general theme, you know, what I saw from Jupiter in Scorpio was learning Jupiter from the darkness, from those things which are hidden. You know, those events which were hidden. You know, Scorpio, as we’ve pointed out, is where Venus is in exile, right? And Jupiter has as one of its significations ‘justice’. Like trying to bring justice to things that were unjust. Also, you know, you had the ‘witch’ thing sort of blow up as a pop culture thing.

KS: That’s true.

CB: Oh, yeah.

AC: This year, you know, at UAC, everybody was like, “Yeah, planetary magic is awesome.” And I was like, “Really? It’s not creepy?” And they were like, “No, it’s great. Keep talking.” Jupiter in Scorpio is definitely pro-occult.

KS: Yes.

CB: Yeah. That was a really big shift. I did notice that as well over the past year. Like this did seem like the year in which suddenly astrological magic was being discussed a lot more frequently and openly and adopted by a lot more people than anything I’ve seen in the past.

AC: Yeah, me, too. And I think that, you know, yeah, Jupiter in Scorpio is just like look for the occultism and witchcraft. And my last Jupiter in Scorpio was great for that, too.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Yeah. I mean, somebody had a book that came out that helped contribute to that a little bit.

KS: Just a little.

AC: You know, just doing my part. The Celestial Art.

CB: Right.

AC: Available through Three Hands Press website or on amazon.com.

KS: I was just doing a little fact-checking. There was a big sex scandal in Australian politics that came out early 2018. So, you know, just a little after the Jupiter ingress, where the deputy prime minister basically was having an affair, and got his other girl on the side pregnant and left his wife with their four daughters to go and be with his lover, I guess. So just to add a little bit of an international edge to some of it. It didn’t have quite the same sort of ‘MeToo’ tone, but a lot of that sexual power dynamic questions were coming, because the woman that he’d have an affair with was actually a staffer in his office. So we saw some of those ‘Jupiter in Scorpio’ things. And he had to resign his deputy prime ministership, which is basically like the vice president. The equivalent of the American vice president level. Justin Trudeau, yeah, did have an ‘MeToo’ thing, too. There were whispers of a scandal. Justin Trudeau’s got a really sharp PR machine and they shut it down pretty quickly. Justin Trudeau is the Canadian prime minister. So I do think a lot of that has been tied—you know, not just in the States—to stories and issues popping up elsewhere.

CB: Yeah. And the article I just found, that I mentioned, it was in The Washington Post, and it titled, “A Year After It Began: Has #MeToo Become a Global Movement?” And it just went through different countries where some of those discussions have come up and became more prominent. And it did consistently have more of a not skeptical, but more of it wasn’t clear how much lasting change, or that the world hadn’t like changed over the course of the past year, but actually a lot of those discussions were starting to happen in different countries. Although, there was, more or less, pushback in some areas rather than others. So I thought that was interesting just in terms of one of the questions that came up really early on was, is this just something happening just after the ingress, that’s limited, or is there gonna be lingering impacts over the course of the next year? And I feel like the answer was, yes, that we did see different sorts of variations of that cropping up all over, over the course of the past year, that felt like they were, you know, not just tied into that transit. Certainly, there were other things going on with the Venus and the Mars retrogrades. But that Jupiter in Scorpio sort of inaugurated the beginning of that a year ago did seem to carry it through the rest of the year in a way that, you know, we weren’t sure if it would at the beginning of the year. But I think we can confirm in retrospect that it kind of did.

AC: Yeah. I said at the time, and I’ll just repeat now, that I do think that the American epicenter of that—and the most dramatic events concerning that happening in America—do have a lot to do with the fact that we just had what was called at the time the ‘Great American Eclipse’, which just from the textbook, you know, with the eclipse in Leo, says, you know, people from great heights will fall. And several of the prominent people who fell had planets very close to that American eclipse, and so, I do think that that can’t be ignored. And we also had the most dramatic cases during the six months following that eclipse, which included Jupiter’s ingress into Scorpio. But, you know, ‘Scorpio-land’ contains things like that, and when you get Jupiter there, it tries to bring those things up. Also, it’s the 12th house of the United States in the Sibley chart. So, yeah.

CB: Sure. And then there were other competing things going on, obviously, in like the birth charts of individuals like, you know, Kevin Spacey. We were very much focused on him having a Saturn return, I believe. I think he had Saturn in Capricorn. And so, a large part of that was tied into his Saturn return and experiencing a negative manifestation of that in terms of looking at his personal transits, but it’s still interesting. You know, in a year that began with Hollywood largely and the MeToo movement and everything else, and then it was kind of capped off over the past month—in the US at least—with the Supreme Court nomination and similar sort of, you know, allegations and other things like that coming into play.

AC: Venus spending a lot of time in the same sign as Jupiter.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Right. Yeah. All right, so that’s Jupiter in Scorpio. I mean, is there any other ‘Jupiter in Scorpio’ stuff that we should mention, in retrospect?

AC: I think that’s good.

KS: I feel like we’ve got the themes.

CB: Yeah.

KS: I’m pretty sure everyone is just eager for whatever new symbolism and energy that Jupiter in Sag is going to unfold or release.

CB: Right. So that brings us to now, to November 7th and 8th, where we have Jupiter moving into Sagittarius, where it’ll stay for a year. Jupiter is coming home. What are you guys looking forward to? What do you anticipate with Jupiter in Sagittarius, as being major sort of overarching themes?

KS: I’m like, “Who wants to go first?”

AC: I’ll start. Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Just one very simple difference is in Scorpio—which is Mars’ domicile—Jupiter is trying to make good from bad, right? It’s trying to take a challenge or a trauma and then transform or redeem that. I used the ‘turning poison into medicine’ as one of my key metaphors for Jupiter in Scorpio. You know, and it’s dealing with the neglected, the rejected. It’s crossing the taboo boundary to find something sacred that everybody thought was profane. Whereas Jupiter in Sag is Jupiter on its own terms. It’s like, you know, it’s ‘Jupiter’ Jupiter stuff. You know what’s exciting? Excitement. You know what’s positive? Positivity.

KS: It’s just lovely to hear your enthusiasm, Austin.

AC: I’ll do my best. I can do Jupiter in Pisces.

KS: I know you can.

AC: Jupiter in Sag is probably an octave too high for me. Why don’t you take over?

KS: An octave too high. I love it. I mean, this is the yang sign of Jupiter. You know, Jupiter has two homes, it has Sag, and it has Pisces. And this is the more extroverted, outgoing, classically, you know, vocal or loud version of Jupiter. Because Pisces, like all water signs, is mute, so there is a softness or an internal tone to Jupiter in Pisces. We also have to remember that when planets move—either by transit or progression—from Scorpio to Sag, they go through a complete recalibration of their qualities. And what I’m speaking to here is that Scorpio is a water sign—so it combines the combinations of cold and wet—whereas Sag being a fire sign is heat and dryness. Sometimes when planets move from one sign to the next, there is a continuity. For example, when a planet goes from Aries to Taurus, it’s going from heat to dry—sorry, from hot to cold, but it’s staying dry, because both fire and air signs are dry. But, you know, Jupiter is getting warmed up. You know, it’s coming out of that cool, fire sign—sorry, the cool, water sign. And the ‘wetness’ of Jupiter in Scorpio, there’s been a lot about the bonding and the enmeshment and of course the emotions. But Jupiter coming into Sag—fiery Sag—is less concerned about the togetherness, and it’s more about the uplifting. You know, how can I raise things up? I always remember reading about fire signs having this connection to, you know, the divine element, because a fire rises upwards. And so, you know, not everything wants to rise upwards or should rise upwards, but things are going to rise up, and as a process, they’re gonna dry out. And I think some of the symbolism there is gonna be really rich to follow over the next 12 months.

AC: Yeah, a hundred-percent. When I was writing dailies which involved Jupiter in Sag, my mind kept being led to the image of like a warm thermal beneath people’s wings. I was like, “Oh, you are the wind beneath my wings.”

KS: Oh, Austin! You’ve got some romance in there.

AC: Well, I was channeling Jupiter in Sag.

KS: I love it.

AC: And also, they made us sing that in like sixth grade choir practice like a million times. But, yeah, it’s that updraft.

KS: It is.

AC: You know, Jupiter in Scorpio was, you know, seeking wisdom, you know, by spiraling down, right? Jupiter in Sag—it’s warm and rising.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Getting above situations, elevating, etc., etc. What’s interesting is with Sag—especially when Jupiter’s there—you know, it’s a dual-sign. And so, you’ll have the ‘party’ side of Sag—which is, you know, the horse likes to party—and then you have the human side, which is, you know, the philosophical, religious, spiritual, uplifting Jupiter side. You know, the philosopher, the quest, etc., etc. And so, Jupiter in Sag pushes both of those. You know, both the ‘horse’ party and the philosophical quest.

KS: Yeah, it does. I think that idea of the quest is a really good metaphor or symbol for Jupiter in Sag. What do you wanna go on a quest for in these next 12 months? What experiences or wisdom or knowledge are going to be, you know, adding value or adding meaning and purpose to your life? And I think one key thing to remember about the sign of Sag is that it’s not a sign that prioritizes ambition. It’s a sign that prioritizes experiences. And so, the idea here is that, you know, we can have growth and progress, but we’re really looking for that enrichment or that engagement. And so, that may be part of, you know, what comes through here.

AC: I would disagree that Sag isn’t ambitious.

KS: Okay.

AC: Respectfully.

KS: No, no, no. I’m like I wanna hear more. You can’t just drop that and then say nothing else. Tell us more.

CB: I mean, really quickly, though, what was your rationalization for that, again, Kelly? Could you say that again briefly?

KS: I guess in contrast to like, say, Saturn or Capricorn, which tends to have this more desire to accumulate and to have that larger, overarching plan. Jupiter and/or Sag is like, “I need the experience. And I might take that before I would do something that might create the stability or the security.”

CB: Right. I have a good example of that. When I think of Sagittarius, I think of Kelly Lee Phipps, who was an astrologer that passed away several years ago, but he had like heavy Sagittarius placements in his chart. He was like ‘Mr. Sagittarius rising’, with Jupiter in Sagittarius and like Mars and Venus and Neptune there as well.

AC: Yeah. The Neptune, I think, is what makes a generation of ‘Sags’ not as ambitious as the ‘archetypal’ Sag itself.

KS: Mm-hmm.

AC: So you can’t have a quest without goals. You can’t have a quest without a reason that is important enough to undergo an ordeal, because there’s no quest without ordeal and challenge. Jupiter’s part is the part of victory. There’s no victory without contest. Jupiter is ambitious. It’s not as structured as Saturn. But Jupiter absolutely wants—especially Jupiter in yang sign—Jupiter has ideas and has victory in mind, has goals in mind, has meaningful action in mind. Jupiter’s methods for overcoming challenges tend to be more peaceable than Mars’ methods. Jupiter won’t fight to fight, but Jupiter absolutely wants victory. And I think, again, the 14 years of Neptune in Sag confuses that a little bit, because a lot of our friends who are, you know, older or younger than us have Neptune in Sag. And so, you know, Neptune softens and blurs and makes more ephemeral whatever the significations of the sign is. So that’s my 10 cents.

CB: Definitely.

AC: I do agree that—

CB: But to speak to what you were talking about, Kelly, you were talking about them not planning it out ahead of time. I think that made a lot of sense, compared to like a ‘Capricorn’ energy or like a ‘Saturn’ energy, but perhaps just like diving into things. That is exactly what Kelly Lee Phipps did with his movie project, which he did towards the end of his life, which is that he wanted to do a documentary on astrology. And he didn’t really have any film-making background, he hadn’t really done a project of that scope or nature before, but he just like started doing it and learned as he went. And, unfortunately, part of the end product was not as good as it could have or should have been or anybody ideally would’ve wanted it to have been as a result of the lack of planning or preparation or training that he had. But he was very much driven by the optimism of just having that higher aspiration or goal in some sense, which still, I think, speaks to what you were talking about there.

KS: Yeah. I mean, there’s definitely that feeling of winging-it that comes through with Jupiter in Sag, or, you know, flying off the cuff. I do agree with a lot of what you’re saying, Austin. I do think that Jupiter wants to rise to the top. I guess I was just sort of speaking that the motivations for that is not necessarily around ambition or success for the sake of achievement. But it’s as you said—it’s like this is a meaningful action, because it fits into some maybe larger belief system or philosophy, or my integrity’s on the line, and therefore, I’m gonna, you know, pursue from that perspective.

AC: Right.

CB: Right.

AC: Kelly Phipps, not Kelly Surtees. You know, he wanted to, you know, show everybody that astrology was amazing and that it was valid. Like his goals were really big.

CB: Right.

KS: Yeah. Yeah, so, I mean, this is a really good discussion. This is very thought-provoking. So I’m really glad that you guys have both shared this.

CB: I’m actually a little concerned about this, cuz we have part two of our zodiac series, which is coming up in just like a week or two, which we need to record. We should be careful not to go too much into plumbing the depths of Sagittarius, since I know that we’re gonna do a lot of that in a couple of weeks here.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Right. But anyway, so Jupiter in Sag is uplifting. It’s positive. It’s very pro-quest, whatever your quest is.

KS: Yes. And I’m gonna quote one of our listeners here, and he knows who he is. He’s just said: “The wind beneath my winging-it,” which I think is just a nice mashup of some of the points we’ve been making today.

CB: So in terms of famous—from my files—people with Jupiter in Sagittarius, strangely, there’s like three US Supreme Court justices. William Rehnquist, Anthony Kennedy, and Antonin Scalia all had Jupiter in Sagittarius. There’s like a judicial end to it traditionally, where Jupiter is associated with judges very literally and the courts. But we’ve also got some interesting artists. Like Van Gogh and TS Elliot had Jupiter in Sagittarius. George RR Martin, Jupiter in Sagittarius, evidently in the 8th house. ‘Weird Al’ Yankovic has Jupiter in Sagittarius. If this birth time is correct, it’s in the 11th house conjunct his midheaven. And, yeah, there’s a few other interesting celebrities. Like Edward Snowden, of course, had Jupiter in Sagittarius in the 7th house, which is kind of interesting. And there’s a few others like random celebrities of that sort.

KS: Which is really interesting. I think one of the points to make about why it’s worthwhile looking at the charts of people who have, say, Jupiter in Sag—or even Saturn in Capricorn, if you’re trying to get a handle on these placements—have a look at how, you know, those themes show up in the story of their life, and that could give you a little bit more about the planet that you might not have read in a textbook, for instance.

CB: Yeah.

AC: Yeah, that’s a good point. One of my favorite ‘Jupiter in Sag’ nativities is Tony Robbins.

KS: Oh, my gosh. He’s like a cliché. I didn’t know he had that.

AC: Yeah. He has the Moon in Aries applying to Jupiter.

KS: Oh, wow.

AC: And he’s got the Sun and Mercury in Pisces ruled by that Jupiter. But he’s like, “I’m a giant man who’s gonna help you do things the right way, and everything’s gonna get better.”

KS: Yeah.

AC: “You know, I’m just gonna be really angry and helpful.”

KS: He does have that angry tone. But I guess he was one—

AC: But he’s like, “Fuck it. I’m gonna help you. I’ll swear. I’ll swear, because I believe in helping you, and that’s what it’s gonna take to make your life better.” It’s all like relentless positive.

KS: It is. It’s sort of like the power of—

AC: Getting yelled at by a nice man?

KS: Yeah, I’m not sure.

CB: Well, yeah. An overwhelming power of like optimism. That’s like a great underlying, ‘Jupiter, but especially Sagittarius-type’ thing. You know, we have to distinguish here. There’s some charts where you’re looking at Jupiter in Sagittarius, and if that’s connected with the ascendant in some way, then the person sometimes is taking on the agency of Jupiter, and they are like becoming Jupiter, and you see that really clearly in their personality. But that’s not always the case. In some charts, it’s showing up in some other area of the person’s life.

AC: Yeah. That could represent their mom in the chart. That could be like, yeah, your mom was like super enthusiastic and powerful and wise. Not everything in the chart is just you. You might have learned stuff from mom and carry some of that. You know, it could literally represent your boss, right? A planet in a chart can represent people in your life, you know. I haven’t looked at Van Gogh’s chart, but that might have been like people who helped him out with his problems or whatever it is.

KS: That’s a really good point to make, for sure. You know, does the Jupiter in Sag rule your 7th house, for instance? Does that mean that you attract partners that are basically Jupiter in Sag? Or does it rule your 4th house? Or is it place in the 4th, where it rules, you know, a parent or your upbringing or what have you?

AC: Yeah.

KS: I’ve had a few clients this week with Jupiter in Sag. Cuz you mentioned Neptune in Sag, Austin, for people of our generation, and of course we did have that period where we had Uranus in Sag. I think it was 1983, maybe 1984.

AC: Yeah. We had like two years of Jupiter and—

KS: Yeah, so Jupiter with Uranus.

AC: Sorry, Neptune and Uranus.

KS: Right. In there together. So it’s really interesting just to think about these sub-generations of the different iterations of Jupiter in Sag.

AC: Yeah. Neptune, Uranus, and Pluto all kind of temporarily distort, for better and worse, the quality of a sign while they’re there.

KS: Yeah.

CB: A friend of the show, Adam Sommer, actually is a Jupiter in Sag conjunct Uranus, conjunct his IC, and it’s squaring his ascendant. It’s a really great example of a Jupiter in Sag. Neptune’s there. It’s much later in the sign. It’s not as tied into that combination. But, yeah, he’s a good example of that.

AC: I know another one of those.

KS: Tell us more.

CB: Another person that has that Jupiter-Uranus conjunction from like the ‘83 timeframe?

AC: Another Gemini from exactly that year.

KS: Excellent.

AC: But, yeah, that’s probably enough on Jupiter in Sag.

KS: Okay. We have definitely clarified the vibe.

AC: Yeah.

CB: The power of optimism, but sometimes optimism having to be almost the only thing that carries you. And sometimes that works out and you can get by or skate by just on optimism, but other times that leaves you with an insufficient foundation. And the end result is less good than it could have been if you had more than just optimism or like enthusiasm going for it.

AC: Yeah. You know, Jupiter isn’t just positive thinking, it’s also positive thinking. You know, Jupiter also is connected with, you know, higher education, higher thinking, you know, larger philosophical concerns. It’s not just like ‘just trust’. You know, it’s not just like ‘think positive, bro’. You know, we shouldn’t reduce it to that, but that is part of it, absolutely.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Sure.

AC: You know, with Jupiter in Sag, I think we can access Zeus myths very directly. So Zeus, or Indra, you know, there are a lot of stories of ‘lightning’ kings, the gods, who are just like super powerful and, you know, generally do a pretty good job, but also mess up a lot. They’ve got a lot of power, but they sometimes don’t think through all of the consequences of their actions. You know, this lightning-wielding, imperfect king is a very strong mythological motif that we can associate with Jupiter in Sag very easily.

KS: Yeah.

CB: And, by the way, one last thing before we move on from this. The 1983 conjunction of Jupiter and Uranus in Sag—huge impact on the astrological community that was felt years later. The company, astro.com, or the company that became astro.com, was founded October 4 of 1983, with Jupiter at 7° of Sag and Uranus at 6° of Sag.

AC: That’s amazing.

KS: Yeah.

CB: In terms of the profound impact that they’ve had in bringing astrology, more advanced forms of astrology, and making them accessible; using technology to make astrology accessible to everybody. And I have to feel like they’re almost single-handedly culpable for the fact that astrology is becoming so much more popular, and it’s not just Sun sign astrology. It’s like a whole generation of people know what their Sun, Moon, and rising sign are, because they can calculate their chart easily and for free on astro.com.

AC: Yeah, that was a huge resource for me in learning astrology.

KS: Me, too.

CB: Yeah, me, too.

KS: Yeah.

CB: You, too, Kelly?

KS: Absolutely, yeah. Sorry, I like jumped in on you guys, cuz I was so ‘Jupiter in Sag’ excited. Yeah, it was a huge resource. And I remember they would put up charts and then there would be discussion, and I would just be a bit of a lurker. You know, before there were enough people locally for me to chat to, the resource was phenomenal, phenomenal. So that’s a ‘Jupiter and Uranus’ exemplar, I guess.

AC: It’s a good one.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Yeah, yeah. That’s a really good one. So we’ll return back to that and talk about that again, but I just wanted to get that out there.

KS: Yeah, that’s good.

CB: So moving back to—

KS: To November.

CB: We’re still in the first week of November.

AC: There’s a New Moon.

KS: Yeah, we sort of skipped over it, didn’t we? 15 Scorpio on the 7th.

AC: Right. So right in the middle of those three changes—Uranus, nodes, Jupiter—we have the lunar cycle resets.

KS: Yeah.

AC: And so, I think that that’s actually a very appropriate time for a New Moon, right? It’s like it’s literally time to reset, because, you know, we have a bunch of changes.

KS: And that word ‘reset’, I kept coming up with as well when I was thinking about these few days in November. I know it’s a regression kind of ingress for Uranus, but it’s a new energy that we haven’t had for six months for Uranus. The nodes are kicking in. We have not had the North Node in Cancer for about 18 years. That’s how long it takes the North Node to get back to a sign. And then, of course, Jupiter—it’s 12 months that it changes signs, but it’s 12 years since Jupiter has been in Sag. So to have a New Moon sandwiched in the middle—everything is kind of being recalibrated and updated. If you like to use computer analogies, you know, new software is starting to run. It’s a different version. You know, I think it’s gonna be an opportunity. It starts this week and then it kind of completes the following week, when Mars actually gets out of Aquarius. But, you know, letting those things that have maybe been taking a lot of time and energy for the last six months or so—you know, we’re just putting them to rest, and we’ve got new projects, new priorities. You know, that breath of fresh air. There are new possibilities coming in. And particularly with the Jupiter in Sag, I always think of the imagery—like with Scorpio, I always viscerally turn my attention to my belly. You know, it’s that navel, internal kind of gaze, whereas with Jupiter in Sag, it’s like this upward/outward, looking much further into the future. And that’s what you’re being asked to do in this early part of November—to look up and out and not get too stuck in with what’s right in front of you.

AC: Yeah, a hundred-percent.

CB: Brilliant. I like that.

KS: Yeah. So the New Moon, I don’t know. Do you wanna say anything else about the New Moon, Austin?

AC: I think that was really good. I would just add that—and I think this is implied by looking up and out—is that, you know, three things change right around that New Moon. Venus is not direct for nine more days, but Venus is within a degree of the direct station degree. So Venus really isn’t going anywhere new, right?

KS: No.

AC: And so, I feel like the modus operandi there is to look around and discover what the new configuration—what this new setup looks like and feels like. Because if you are just like, “Okay, done with one month, now I’m gonna do another,” and assume that it’s going to be of the same character, or even a similar character, you’re going to be incorrect. Look up and out in order to see what’s changed and see where the road goes. Because, again, if you plot the trajectory based on the last month and the last month and the last month and the last month and the last month, you’re going to be dead wrong, cuz the road curves here.

KS: Yeah. Which is a really beautiful point that you wanna pay attention to, because the landscape is shifting. And even though the year has had a lot of repetition, this is not a month where we continue that.

AC: Yeah. It’s where we finally break out of it.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Thank goodness.

KS: Chris swore last month and it was okay.

CB: Yeah. It can be like the FCC, and you can get one in like on each episode and that’s fine.

KS: That’s it.

AC: Oh, I should have saved mine.

CB: You gotta use it wisely.

KS: Use it wisely. I mean, I don’t know about you, Austin. I mean, after this November 6th to 8th period, my focus shifts right to the 15th and 16th.

AC: A hundred-percent. We’re on the same page.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Cuz then Mars moves into not-Aquarius.

KS: Thank goodness.

CB: So Mars into Pisces on November 15.

KS: Honestly, let’s have a ‘Pisces’ party that day.

AC: Oh, love it.

KS: Right. The other thing, too, is that since the middle of March 2018, Mars has been in Saturn-ruled signs.

CB: That’s a good point.

KS: Just Mars in Saturn-ruled signs.

CB: Right.

KS: I mean, I love a bit of Saturn like the next girl, but I take something different just to mix it up a bit.

AC: Yeah, I love Mars in Pisces. My Mars return is always glorious.

KS: So you should tell us—you should lead off about this one, Austin.

AC: Well, I think my experience is probably very particular to someone with Mars in Pisces, for whom Mars is playing an important role in their chart. But, you know, Mars in Pisces, among other things, it is the power of the imagination. You know, it’s that yin power, also that flow. I kind of feel like Mars in Pisces is sort of like half-Mars in Scorpio/half-Mars in Cancer. Like you get some of that just Mars being comfortable in a water sign that you see with Mars in Scorpio. You do get a little bit of the oversensitivity that you see with Mars in Cancer, cuz Mars is kind of horrible in Cancer and kind of amazing in Scorpio. Pisces is sort of like half of both, and then sprinkle some fairy dust on it.

KS: Austin, I just can’t believe that phrase. You used ‘sparkles of gold’ in this episode and ‘fairy dust’.

AC: That’s true. You know, I’ve been known to sprinkle things.

KS: This is great. I mean, I totally get where you’re coming, and I just hadn’t pulled it together myself that Mars in Pisces is like a mashup of Mars in Cancer versus Mars in Scorpio. It’s like the middle-point of Mars in the water signs.

AC: Right. It’s not perfect dignity.

KS: No.

AC: There’s not a problem. You know, it doesn’t get stuck in its depression or fall. You know, it’s good as far as like if you wanna kick things. Mars rules the feet, it’s good for that.

KS: Now this is the Austin we know and love.

AC: Well, you know, that I’m amazing at kicking things.

KS: You are.

AC: Yeah.

KS: Like you could have been a soccer player or something?

AC: No, no. Bodies.

KS: Of course. I love it. That’s great.

AC: No, that was the first martial art that I got good at—just kicking the bejesus out of things.

KS: Oh, my lord.

AC: Like back when I was a boy, in class, in a sparring situation, I kicked someone hard enough into the wall that there was an imprint of them in the wall. You know, having Mars in Pisces opposite Saturn in Virgo, I’ve broken four or five toes kicking people. I’ve broken my right foot kicking people. I had my jaw broken by a kick.

KS: Somebody kicked you?

AC: Yeah.

KS: Wow.

AC: Not that everybody should start kicking things, that aside. We’ll come back to that maybe during our zodiac discussion. But, yes, Pisces rules the feet, and Mars there, natally, can quite literally represent hitting with feet. You know, it’s like an energetic, imaginative, kind of flowy, can be too oversensitive.

CB: Yeah. I mean, when you’re talking about like Mars in Pisces, like Pisces is such a ‘squishy’ sign.

AC: It’s ruled by Jupiter, Chris.

CB: Right. I realize that.

AC: It’s not ruled by Neptune. Clean your mind.

CB: It is the most mutable of the four mutable signs in terms of both the flexibility, which is good, but also, sometimes the almost like directionless or sort of flowing nature.

KS: The flakiness. Let’s just be specific here.

CB: I wasn’t gonna go there. But, I mean, if you say it, since you’re the ‘Pisces stellium’ person, then it’s okay.

KS: I mean, I was just saying this to someone in a flower shop of all places yesterday that, you know, I think Pisces is true to its dual nature, and Pisceans are one extreme or the other, basically.

AC: And.

KS: What? One extreme ‘and’ the other. I like it. I like it. I see what you did there.

AC: Yeah. They’re actually chained together at the mouth.

KS: That’s true. Yeah, how many other people were in the flower shops because it’s Friday? Yeah, Pisces is very squishy, for sure. I think someone’s gonna have to hashtag that, Chris. That was great. But, you know, one of the good things, if I speak out, on this specific ‘Mars in Pisces’ sojourn, it will be ruled by Jupiter in Sag.

AC: Yeah.

KS: So that’s—

CB: If I may counterpoint—

KS: Bring it on.

CB: Neptune is right in the middle of Pisces at this point, and Mercury’s gonna station retrograde at 13° of Sagittarius around mid-November, very closely squaring Neptune at 13° of Pisces. So we have like a full-blown Mercury-Neptune square right in the middle of this month, and then Mars comes in right about the same time to join the party in that sign. And while it doesn’t make it up to Neptune until next month, December, it’s still kind of like joining that party. You know, we’re already in the squishy sign of Pisces, and we’re joining Neptune, squaring Mercury there.

KS: You do make a good point, Chris. And that weekend, I mean, November 16th and 17th—which is when Mercury stations retrograde 13 Sag—it’s also the weekend or the time in the month when the Moon comes to Neptune in Pisces. This is an example of ‘Piscean’ forgetfulness.

CB: Right.

KS: And so, there’s quite a squishy pileup there in the middle of the month. I will concede this.

AC: I think it’s gonna be pretty exciting. The Mars square Jupiter is a pretty fun rowdy.

KS: And that’s on the 19th.

AC: Yeah. And that Jupiter’s very active.

KS: I feel like it’s gonna help Mars do something. Sorry, Austin, I cut you off.

AC: Oh, no, no. I agree. What I usually find is when Mars is close to Neptune, Mars almost disappears. You know, it seems like Neptune really dominates Mars, especially in Pisces.

KS: Yeah.

AC: I think during like, maybe, let’s say, 5° on either side, 6° on either side, it’s almost gonna be like, you know, you go from ‘flexible’ Mars in Pisces to just dissolving, right?

CB: Right.

AC: And so, I think that’s quite valid. But, you know, we’ve got Mars in Pisces until January.

KS: Yeah, that specific 3°, plus or minus, to Neptune-Mars that you’re speaking about, Austin, the timeframe for that looks like it’s about November 28 through to around December 12. So that is our ‘super squishy’ period. But, Chris, you’re really trying to talk about the Mercury square Neptune aspect, and Austin and I can’t stop talking about Mars in Pisces.

CB: I mean, I just feel like that’s one of the signatures of the month, cuz it’s like right there in the middle. And it’s like, okay, we get a Mercury retrograde every few months. But Mercury square Neptune—just as an aspect in and of itself—is like a natal signature. Mercury-Neptune is one of those aspects that is so stark to me sometimes and just straightforward in its manifestation. And to have Mercury station retrograde squaring Neptune—that seems like a major signature to me right in the middle of the month.

AC: Hundred-percent. And just to be clear for people, so Mars enters Pisces on the 15th, Venus stations direct on the 15th—or sorry, 16th. It’s 15th, 15th, 16th?

KS: Yeah, I’ve got Eastern timezone 15th,16th, 17th. So all around that mid-month period.

AC: Right. This is why we jumped, cuz it’s another trio of rapid-fire changes. And, you know, Chris, I agree. I find that I don’t know if there’s any planet that afflicts Mercury’s action—like its core significations—as much as Neptune.

CB: Right.

AC: Mercury is like, “Let’s sort things,” and Neptune’s like, “It’s all one.”

CB: Right. Because it’s like Saturn can inhibit Mercury. It can like inhibit speech or stop it from happening, in sometimes very literal ways. But Neptune does something else to it. It like warps it, in this interesting way, what Mercury’s trying to communicate.

AC: Yeah, I think that this is actually a part of what I was saying about the New Moon. Like just look around. Don’t come in like super ‘A-to-B-to-C planned where you don’t have to, because Mercury retrograde in its detriment square Neptune is not particularly clear of path. And so, pray for me, cuz I’m gonna be flying across the ocean three days after the station.

KS: Well, I mean, I always say long-distance travel is an exercise in surrender. You enter the system and you give up control over what happens and when. You have a number that somebody else is managing, and you will get where you need to go as the system chugs you through, and that is part and parcel of Neptune and Mercury together. It’s that surrendering of logical or rational or fact-based kinds of control or planning.

CB: Right. Fact-based. I think that’s a good way of putting it. Like we’re relinquishing the fact-based approach, I think, is a good way of putting the manifestation which is the more deceptive sort of tendencies of Mercury and Neptune as one of the things that I am always a little more nervous about sometimes. It makes me nervous seeing it on a larger, like mundane scale. What does a larger scale signature of deception mean in a broader, mundane context?

KS: Sounding very familiar. Did we have something like this last year? Yes.

CB: Yeah, probably.

KS: December 2017, Mercury stationed direct at 13 Sag, and Neptune was at 11 Pisces. And I think we talked about that idea of misinformation or, you know, maybe deceit or deception or illusion coming out.

AC: Yeah. Well, see what the news says about what.

CB: Yeah. I mean, I don’t know. Somebody mentioned to me being a little nervous about it happening after some of the election stuff happening in the US. I don’t necessarily wanna go there fully, cuz that’s a whole other can of worms. But, yeah, I mean, on the bright side, though, it’s a very positive illusion sometimes. Or the illusion that Mercury-Neptune is able to create sometimes is very good when you’re in like the sphere of it, and it’s only once you step outside of that. And that may be the thing for many of the people if you get hit by this transit, that it’s not until you get to the other end that you may realize that everything you were experiencing or thought you were seeing while you were in the epicenter of it was not quite what it seemed at the time.

KS: Yeah. And—go, Austin.

AC: I was just gonna say, you know, what I think about this is that, you know, this is Mercury stationing retrograde in Jupiter’s sign, which Jupiter just ingressed into. You know, as far as your wayfinding and journeying goes, follow Jupiter.

KS: Yeah.

AC: You know, Mercury is, in a sense, subservient to Jupiter here. You know, follow the quest. You might not know the road, but you know you’re going north, so go north, right?

KS: Yeah.

AC: You know, the actual pathways don’t look like they’re going to be incredibly clear with Mercury square Neptune. But, you know, if you know that you’re headed southeast, you can find a way southeast. Like Jupiter is that compass bearing.

CB: But what if there’s like a really appealing-looking, gingerbread house like off to the side, in a little path, as you’re on your way there? Do you stop and partake?

KS: I think with the ‘mutable’ mojo, you are allowed tangents and distractions, but you don’t stay in the tangents or distractions. You might need to snack in the gingerbread house. And then when your belly’s full, and you’ve had enough to carb-coma crash, then you get back on and you keep going southeast.

CB: Wait, no. That’s not the right answer. Because in like, you know, the myths and stuff, that’s when you get eaten by someone.

AC: Yeah, you are the snack in the gingerbread house.

CB: Right, exactly. It’s to lure you in, and then you disappear or something.

KS: Like the big, bad wolf.

AC: But, honestly, I think this is a generally pretty beneficent confusion, cuz we have Jupiter right there with Mercury.

KS: And Jupiter is the lord of all of it in this mess. If we’re talking about squishy stuff, Jupiter’s in charge of the lot.

AC: Jupiter gets to run the show. There’s no Saturn.

KS: Chris, you’re not believing us, are you?

CB: Well, it’s just that earlier in the show, we established that Jupiter was disappearing at almost the exact same time. Which, traditionally, actually the ‘weird things going on behind the scenes or being covered’ in ancient astrology was planets under the beams, so it’s interesting that Jupiter disappears right about the same time. And Mars also is showing up into Pisces where it’s squaring Jupiter. Even though, normally, we’re gonna say Jupiter’s in the superior position and has the upper-hand there, it’s weird that Mars is actually gonna be the position to sort of afflict Jupiter on some level right about the same time. I’m just saying it’s complicated. That’s all I’m saying.

KS: It’s complicated. I mean, the quote that keeps coming into my mind—it’s a Rumi quote that talks about ‘sniffing with your wisdom nose’, and I think that’s sort of what we’re alluding to here. You can’t think your way through this. There isn’t enough data or information that is gonna help guide you forward. There is a little bit of that leap of faith or that trust required.

AC: Or using other senses.

KS: Other senses is a great way of putting it, yeah. But it is complicated, even though it looks like an uplifting mess.

CB: Sure. So this is the middle of the month. Do we really have much towards the end of the month? It looks like we have a couple of things. We’ve got a lunation, and we’ve got Neptune stationing direct.

AC: The Sun moves into Sag.

KS: And these three things you guys just mentioned—November 22nd, 23rd, 24th. Another three-day whammy.

CB: Yeah. So November 22, it looks like the Sun goes into Sag. And then very, very shortly after that, the Moon moves into Gemini. So we get a Full Moon. A weird discussion topic came up on a forum I saw recently—on like a professional forum for astrologers on Facebook—where they said some astrologer was claiming that the Full Moon is dictated by the sign that the Sun is in. So they actually misunderstood or reversed it somehow. But just for clarification, if anybody doesn’t know, the sign of the Full Moon is the sign that the Moon is in when it hits the opposition with the Sun, just in terms of like basic astrologer terminology.

KS: Yeah, the lunations are governed by the placement of the Moon.

AC: Yeah, it’ll always be opposite the Sun on a Full Moon. So Sun in Gemini—or excuse me, Sun in Sag, Full Moon in Gemini.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Right. But it’s dictated—

KS: By the Moon placement. We’re calling this a Gemini Full Moon, not a Sag Full Moon.

CB: Right. I just wanted to make sure that was clear, so people don’t mix it up or reverse it somehow.

AC: As one of our audience members puts it: “The sign of the Full Moon is the sign the Full Moon is in.”

CB: Interesting.

AC: Just for clarity’s sake.

KS: Just to be really clear. I mean, I think the definition of a Full Moon is when the Sun and Moon are opposite, but there should be no confusion of where the Moon is at that point of opposition.

CB: Right. I think it was just a question of which sign then you’re placing the emphasis on. And in this case, Kelly, that’s where your point is just really good. The lunation is being dictated by the Moon. That’s what we’re focused on in that cycle.

KS: Totally. So if it’s a New Moon, where is the Moon? If it’s a Full Moon, where is the Moon? You just keep coming back to ‘where is the Moon’ for these things.

CB: Definitely.

KS: Yeah.

CB: All right.

KS: And that’s at 0 Gemini. So it is adding to the ‘mutable’ madness that is otherwise happening in the sky.

CB: Oh, wow, yeah.

KS: So, you know, the Sun is conjunct Jupiter. The Moon is gonna apply to square Mars. So, you know, we do have a lot of tension, if you like. But I always think mutable tension is not quite as frustrating or stressful as like fixed, if this configuration was in fixed signs, for instance.

CB: Yeah. I mean, I don’t know. My experience from the outside of ‘mutable’ tension, working with a ‘mutable’ person, is like feeling there’s a lot of urgency and like the deadline is coming up, but the ‘mutable’ person is like, you know, “It’ll happen; we’ll get to it when it’s time,” or something like that. Like there’s less of a sense of urgency or something of that nature. Maybe that’s not a good way to put it. How do you guys feel about deadlines? As two ‘mutable’ people, I guess you both have Saturn opposing that, so that’s something you’re able to balance out a little bit more.

AC: The ‘mutable’ people. The ‘mutable’ people. Sorry.

KS: Austin, tell us. What is your answer to the question? No answer?

AC: Yeah, I think Chris is right. You know, mutable is adaptive.

CB: Say that again. Mutable, what?

AC: You handle things as they arise. Mutable is adaptive, right? It’s like, “Oh, okay, so this is the situation. So I’ll take this stance to solve this problem. Next situation.” You know, fixed is like, “No, we’re doing things this way, and we’re gonna make sure that they happen this way.” And cardinal is like dreaming up how things are gonna go. And so, yeah, you know, I think mutable is more flexible in adapting to surprising situations, which is useful. It’s also more flexible about continuing things as they’ve been built. It’s like, “Yeah, we don’t have to keep doing it this way,” which is annoying for fixed planets, cuz they’re like, “No, no, no, I’m trying to do this pattern.” But, yeah, it’s adaptable. Mutable is reactive relative to both the fixed and cardinal signs. And it doesn’t mean that it’s necessarily passive, right? So, for example, with Sag, we have like, okay, how do I react to the situation in order to achieve my goals? And going back to quest for Jupiter in Sag, there’s no myth or story of a quest that precedes from the beginning in the way that it is imagined at the beginning. The quest is always like, “Well, then this happened, and then this happened, and then this god threw this curve ball in.” It’s very like trying to achieve, you know, Sag, active fire, but by reacting and adapting to the curve balls.

CB: Yeah. Christina in the chat says: “Nimble.” I think that’s a really good term.

KS: Yeah. You know, you asked, Chris, about mutable and deadlines. I don’t know. Maybe it’s a little bit of a personal experience. I used to be very afraid of deadlines right up until my Saturn return. Like the fear of God would be in me about a deadline. And then after my Saturn return, that softened a little bit. And sometimes my feeling towards a deadline now is it’s little of like a suggestion rather than a firm thing. Which I’m not necessarily promoting that, because I know that’s not functional; it’s not, you know, reliable. But do think the mutable way, you know, definitely gets distracted or goes off on tangents, but, you know, it can get there in the end, for sure.

AC: Yeah, I think it’s cuz I’m even more mutable than you, Kelly, I think, chart-wise. Ooh, I don’t know. You have mutable rising, but I have a mutable Moon.

KS: I have a mutable Moon, too.

AC: Oh, you do.

KS: I’m gonna throw down with my mutable.

AC: You do, you do. I apologize. I apologize. I think you win. Not that it was a contest. My point is—or the point I was going to make is that it is worth noting that Saturn is not dignified in any of the mutable signs.

KS: Correct. It doesn’t have any kind of positive dignity.

AC: It has triplicity dignity in some of them.

KS: In the air signs.

AC: And it has a bound or a decan. It has a bound in all of them, and it has a decan in some of them. But there’s no, you know, serious dignity. There’s no—

KS: I wanna say substantial, but I don’t wanna be offensive to someone around that.

AC: Yeah. The mutable signs—none of them are Saturnian in quality. Virgo is probably the closest in some senses.

KS: Yeah.

CB: My take-home phrase is gonna be, from now on, for mutables, ‘deadlines are a suggestion’.

KS: I knew you would like that, Chris.

CB: That’s for that, Kelly. All right.

KS: It came from when my parents came to visit us in Canada, and we went on this big road trip. And my husband and I, Peter and I, are in one car, and my mom and dad were in another car. And we stopped for a break, and my dad said, “So speed limits are a suggestion here in Canada, are they?” because the Canadians just drive. So that’s what popped into my head. I was like, “Yeah, it’s just a guideline, but we’re not fixed and firm about it.”

AC: Yeah. The planets which rule the mutable signs are Mercury and Jupiter, right? Both of which are somewhat flexible, especially when compared to, say, Mars or Saturn.

KS: Yeah.

CB: That might be a good keyword for Mars in Pisces, that ‘speed limits are a suggestion’.

KS: This is a funny episode.

CB: Speaking of, we’re actually getting towards the end of it.

KS: Yes.

CB: So the very last thing in that combination was just Neptune’s basically stationing direct at 13 Pisces right after that Full Moon. It stations about the 23rd, it looks like.

KS: Oh, yeah, don’t forget your election, too, Chris.

CB: I have already successfully forgotten it. Let me switch over to that.

KS: And I didn’t remember. That was our lovely friend, Arthur.

CB: Thank you, Arthur. You saved me from—

KS: Saved Chris’ bacon.

CB: Yeah. So let me pull that up. Cuz Leisa actually had a hard time finding elections this month. She found some standard Capricorn rising ones that we’ve been doing for a while. She found a Pisces rising one. But we ended up going with one of the Sag rising ones in order to show off a little bit of what we’re gonna be looking at for elections during the course of the next year. As we’ve got Jupiter in Sagittarius, we wanna take advantage of that, basically, and make some charts where that’s the focal point of the electional chart. So this isn’t the best month to really show that off, actually, because of all that ‘mutable’ stuff that’s going on, especially with Mercury getting ready to station retrograde in the middle of Sagittarius and Neptune also stationing in mid-Pisces. So, unfortunately, it’s hard to get around this month. If you’re gonna do elections, you’re basically gonna have Mercury square Neptune one way or another, no matter what you do. So it’s sort of something you have to just deal with. That being said, the other reason why this is not fully taking advantage of Jupiter in Sagittarius yet is because Jupiter is so early in the sign, that it’s very hard to get the Moon applying to a conjunction with Jupiter, which we’re gonna be able to do later this year, which is gonna be very nice. So in this chart, we, instead, made the Moon applying to Venus. So the electional chart for this month that we decided to highlight is set for November 10, 2018, at about eight o’clock in the morning. So 8:00 AM, local time. Set it to eight o’clock, whatever your city you’re in. Set the chart so that early Sagittarius is rising. So let’s say about 3-ish degrees of Sagittarius rising, so that Jupiter is conjunct the ascendant, it’s in the first whole sign house. Or even if you’re using quadrant houses, it’s still within a few degrees of the ascendant degree. So you’ve got Jupiter in Sagittarius in the 1st house. It’s a day chart. Jupiter is ruling the 1st house and the 4th house. Mercury is also in Sagittarius in the 1st house. And the Moon is in Sagittarius at around 23°, applying to a sextile with Venus at 25° of Libra, which is located in the 11th house of friendship. And Venus is just getting ready to station retrograde just a few days after—or station direct just a few days later.

So it’s a great 1st house chart, cuz the ruler of the 1st house is in its own sign, it’s of-the-sect-in-favor, it’s a benefic. This is gonna be really good if you wanna take on the agency of that optimistic Jupiter that we were talking about earlier in the show and do something where that sort of enthusiasm or optimism, and the ability to have that carry you is really used to its fullest extent, this would be a good chart for it. It’s got some nice ‘11th house’ things going on with friendship, with the Moon applying to that 11th house Venus. So in terms of building alliances or friends or other things of that nature. It’s not a terrible chart for financial matters. There may be some difficulties at the beginning with Saturn in the 2nd house. However, it’s in Capricorn, and it’s a day chart. So this is one of those things where, while it may start off slowly, it will build up and get better over time, and generally could be better for financial matters than some of the charts we’ve been showing over the past few months. The major problematic area is Mars in a day chart in the 3rd house, but it’s not otherwise afflicting anything major in the chart. And one of the reasons we went with this chart rather than one later in the month is, of course, we’re gonna get into some complications once Mars moves into Pisces. Because then for a while, when we’re trying to do some of these Sagittarius rising charts, we’re gonna have Mars in the 1st house, sometimes squaring Jupiter or other Sagittarius planets, which is a little bit more problematic. So that’s why we decided to go with this one. So this is the chart we decided to highlight this month. We have other charts that might be better elections, that we’re gonna go over on the Auspicious Elections Podcast, which is for patrons. But we wanted to save those and introduce those on that, and we just wanted to highlight this as one of the, you know, Jupiter in Sagittarius elections, which are very similar to ones we’re gonna be seeing for the next 12 months.

KS: So it’s like a taste of what’s to come, I guess, too.

CB: Yeah, exactly.

AC: Yeah. I have a feeling that all of our elections, or about three-quarters of them, are going to be Sag rising for the next 13 months.

KS: “Oh, look, the Moon’s applying to Jupiter in Sag,” or “Venus is applying,” or what have you.

AC: Yeah. It’s good. It’s good. Gotta make the most of it. It’s not gonna last.

KS: Yeah. And I think I was talking with Ryhan at the conference last weekend, and I think we realized that Venus is actually gonna go through Sag twice while Jupiter is there. So there’ll be some nice elections, I guess, around that.

CB: Nice. Yeah, that’s very nice.

KS: Yeah.

CB: So, yeah, so this is a preview. And we’ve got, I think, four or five other elections we’re gonna go over on the Auspicious Elections Podcast, which we’re recording, I think tomorrow or the next day. So find out more information about that at theastrologypodcast.com/subscribe. And people on the $5 and $10 Patreon tiers are able to access that as soon as it’s posted. So that is my election for the month. Thanks to Leisa Schaim for finding that. You can find out more information about her work at leisaschaim.com. All right, guys, this is kind of bringing us to the end of this episode. And, unfortunately, it looks like our time is just about up. Are there any final thoughts about November that we need to mention, or major things that we should have mentioned that we overlooked in the past two-and-a-half hours?

KS: My one-sentence summary for November is it is a massive reset. So let the past be the past and start thinking about where you wanna go in the future. And I agree with Austin’s point around Jupiter being invisible. You don’t necessarily have to make the future happen now, but you wanna set your sights on where you wanna go.

AC: Yeah, I’m in agreement with Kelly here. And I would just say, you know, not only is Jupiter going invisible—so the Sun being conjoined Jupiter have that meeting. You know, the Sun and Jupiter are gonna have a little talk. Jupiter’s like, “All right, I’m in Sag now, we’re gonna do this for the next year,” and they agree on stuff. Jupiter in December becomes visible again, and we have the Mercury retrograde at the same time. And so, think about the future, but don’t set it all in stone until we get Mercury direct, and until Jupiter becomes visible again, which are about the same time, right? So this is definitely ‘think about things’. Think about all of the pathways and, you know, all the quests you wanna go on. But, you know, in some ways, I think this could be used as getting a jump on what your 2019 is gonna be like. So by the time we get to mid-December, you know exactly what quest you’re going on, what you’re gonna try to learn, where you’re gonna try to expand, etc., etc., cuz we will have done a lot of thinking about that. Because Mercury is gonna go over Jupiter twice more later, when Mercury retrogrades back and then hits it again direct. So it’s a lot of rethinking around Jupiter.

CB: Brilliant. I love that. All right. I think that’s great, what both of you said, and just the idea that we’re going into Jupiter in Sagittarius and this is the foundational phase. But there might be better times in the future—as I was saying with the electional charts—to really take advantage of that energy a few months from now. And while now might be a great time to develop some of the inspiration—and people might start doing some of the research or heading in the direction and start becoming more inspired to head in a new direction—actually laying down some of the concrete plans for that and starting to execute them might be better done a few months from now. Especially once we start seeing Jupiter again in the sky, and it emerges from its period of invisibility. All right, guys, I think that brings us to the end of November. So thanks a lot for joining me today for the forecast for November of 2018. We’ll be back again next month, and it will be December. So that means it’s time to do our year ahead for the entire year of 2019, which will be the next installment of the forecast series next month. Are you guys ready for that?

AC: We’re gonna have to do it early.

KS: Okay, hang on. Do we not do December, and then we do the year ahead?

CB: Yeah, I guess, actually, you’re right. When do we do it? We usually do it in early December.

KS: We usually do it at the end of December, we usually do the year ahead.

CB: You are right. So we’ve got one more forecast episode to get out of the way, which will be the December forecast. And then, technically, in December, that’s when we’ll release the—good thinking, Kelly. You’re on this.

KS: That’s okay. I’m already planning. Like after Christmas, we’re gonna sit down, do our year ahead episode. And we’ll have to work around Austin’s travel schedule, too.

AC: I’ll be back by the 11th of December.

KS: For the year ahead, yes. But for the December month ahead—

AC: Yeah, I leave on the 19th, so we’ll have to do it before then.

KS: Okay. We’ll get scheduling.

CB: 19th of November, okay. All right, well, we’ll get to work on that, and we’ll be back again next month. Thanks a lot guys for joining me today. Be sure to check out Austin and Kelly’s websites at kellysastrology.com and austincoppock.com. You can find out more information about the podcast at theastrologypodcast.com. Thanks to everybody. We had a very lively chat session room going in the sidebar the entirety of this. So thanks to the 30 or 40 patrons who joined us for the live recording of this episode. It’s always fun. Thanks to all the patrons that support the podcast each month. We wouldn’t be able to do it without you. If you wanna support the podcast, then just find out more information at theastrologypodcast.com/subscribe. All right, guys, thanks a lot for joining us, and that’s it for this episode. We’ll see you again next month.