The Astrology Podcast

Transcript of Episode 146, titled:

Astrology Forecast for March 2018

With Chris Brennan and guests Austin Coppock and Kelly Surtees

Episode originally released on February 28, 2018

Original episode URL:

https://theastrologypodcast.com/2018/02/28/astrology-forecast-for-march-of-2018/

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Note: This is a transcript of a spoken word podcast. If possible, we encourage you to listen to the audio or video version, since they include inflections that may not translate well when written out. Our transcripts are created by human transcribers, and the text may contain errors and differences from the spoken audio. If you find any errors then please send them to us by email: theastrologypodcast@gmail.com

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Transcribed by Andrea Johnson

Transcription released November 14th, 2025

Copyright © 2025 TheAstrologyPodcast.com

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CHRIS BRENNAN: Hi, my name is Chris Brennan, and you’re listening to The Astrology Podcast. This episode was recorded on Monday, February 26, 2018, starting at 9:58 AM in Denver, Colorado, and this is the 146th episode of the show. For more information about how to subscribe to the podcast and help support the production of future episodes by becoming a patron, please visit theastrologypodcast.com/subscribe. In this episode, I’m gonna be talking with astrologers Kelly Surtees and Austin Coppock about the astrological forecast for March of 2018. Hey, guys, welcome back to the show.

AUSTIN COPPOCK: Hey, Chris.

KELLY SURTEES: Hey, Chris. Hey, Austin.

AC: Hey, Kelly.

CB: Hey, it’s been a whole month since I saw you guys last, and I know both of you have been up to a lot. Kelly, you didn’t go very far. Cuz we did two episodes together already this month and I think caught up a bunch of our listeners who were missing you during our January episodes.

KS: Yes, we did. We definitely made up the missing out on January, for sure. Yeah, I’ve just been home. I’ve been teaching, seeing clients, and just kind of getting settled for the year. Not gallivanting around the globe on boats like Austin, which sounds very fun.

CB: Right. Austin, you have been on vacation these past couple of weeks, right?

AC: Yeah, for about a week-and-a-half now. And I’m actually still on vacation, technically, although this is sort of half-work/half-vacation.

CB: Right. So you went on like a cruise or something?

AC: I did. I went on a Carnival Cruise, and I was on a boat for a week. As I was telling Kelly earlier, I got on the cruise the day before the Sun entered Pisces. And so, the first day that I woke up on a giant boat, in the middle of the Caribbean, the Sun entered Pisces. So it was—it  all very appropriate. It was certainly the right time to enjoy aquatic life.

CB: Brilliant. That sounds like a good way to act in accordance with the transits at the time. And that was partially an election, partially convenience, right?

AC: Yep, yep, yep.

CB: Cool, all right. All right, and so why don’t we get into things. So let’s see—things to mention or news and announcements. Kelly, you just did your progressed Venus webinar, right?

KS: I did. We just recorded that last weekend, so the video recording is now available. And I was really happy with it actually, cuz we got to touch on—I felt like I was able to make it a really complete presentation. I did a very basic intro about how to figure out where your progressed Venus is at the start. And then one of the examples I used towards the end of the webinar was very fancy—like progressed-to-progressed aspects—just to show how involved you can get with that stuff if you want. Yeah, so that’ll be a great webinar, whether you’re new to progressions or you’ve been using them for a while. So that’s now available just on my website.

CB: Awesome. Brilliant. Yeah, everybody seems to have really liked our secondary progressions episode. And I’m glad we got a chance to do that, cuz I can’t believe I hadn’t done an episode on that topic so far.

KS: Yeah, it seems to have filled a gap, and we’ve had some good comments and feedback coming through. So, yeah, thanks for having me for that. It was a lot of fun to do.

CB: Yeah, definitely. And, Austin, you’re a fan of—are you a fan of secondary progressions?

AC: I use them.

KS: You’re not a big fan though, are you?

AC: If I was as good as Kelly is with them, I would probably use them a lot more.

CB: Very, very nice. Very nice.

AC: No—I mean, no, literally, that’s a truth. It actually came up. I do a monthly—I do a monthly live session with my upper tier Patreon patrons, and a bunch of people were asking me about secondary progressions, because they had heard the podcast. And, you know, I can do a little bit with it, and I helped some people figure out what a station in a progressed chart meant. But I was like, “Really, you should just get it from Kelly.”

KS: Thank you.

AC: Yeah.

KS: It’s funny. Like I guess everybody has those little techniques that they just get connected to very early in their journey with astrology. Cuz I find these timing techniques, the more you use them, the more intimately—you become familiar with the nuances of what they have to offer.

AC: Absolutely.

KS: Like people ask me about releasing techniques, and I’m like, “You’ve just gotta go to Chris.” You know, I’m not there yet. I can do a basic ‘this is kind of how it works’. But if you want something really nuanced, I’m not the gal for you.

AC: Yeah, I feel that way, too. Somebody asked me—actually I was asked twice over the last two weeks, “Who’s the best astrologer?”

KS: Oh, my goodness!

AC: You know, and I said, “Well, it doesn’t really work like that.” I was like, “I have people that I will go to for specific ‘excellences’,” right?

KS: Yes.

AC: I was like, “If I want somebody’s opinion about secondary progressions, I will talk to Kelly,” right? “You know, if I want someone’s opinion about Hellenistic astrology, I will talk to Chris,” etc. And I named—and I’m like, “These are my specialists. These are the people that I trust to be excellent in their corner of things, as well as generally proficient.”

CB: Right.

AC: I don’t think there’s a ‘best’ astrologer. I was like, “It’s not like cage fighting. You can’t just put a—you can’t just pit us two-by-two until a victor emerges.”

CB: Right. Well, that’s really funny, cuz I’ve seen some comedians talk about that recently, and they were talking about the difference between the comedy scene versus boxing, where there’s literally a heavyweight champion who is recognized as like the best fighter at the time. Or at least the one who’s won all of the fights up to that point. But when it comes to something like a timing technique, there’s really that dual issue in astrology of, one the one hand, there’s certain techniques that people become more interested in, that really speak to individual astrologers. And everybody gravitates towards or eventually finds that one technique or that set of techniques that really speak to them in terms of what they’re trying to do with astrology. But then on the other hand the other issue is just that the field is so vast that no one astrologer can master every timing technique and every astrological technique or branch out there. And so, you end up needing to really decide at some point in your studies what you want to focus on and what you want to specialize in.

AC: Yeah. And I would say that that’s in part a decision, and it’s also in part just yielding to what you get the most out of and can see most deeply into. You know, like, Kelly, you probably didn’t sit down and say, “I’m gonna be a master of secondary progressions.”

KS: No.

AC: No, there are just certain things, and you’re like, “Oh, that’s really interesting,” and you find yourself spending more time with it. And then maybe that’s where the decision comes in, cuz you’re like, “Oh, I guess maybe this should become my thing.” Like with decans—I was interested in decans at 22, and I ended up writing a book about them 10 years later, but that was because I’d been interested in them as soon as I discovered them.

KS: Yes.

AC: Oh, by the way, 36 Faces is sold out.

KS: Sold out—

CB: Oh, yeah.

KS: —sold out. No more print runs?

AC: The publisher’s sold out. The publisher’s distributor sold out. I have like a box or maybe half-a-box—maybe like 10-15 books that I will sell most of—back in my office. But they’re pretty much gone.

CB: Wow.

AC: All editions.

CB: Wow.

AC: So that’s fun.

CB: Yeah.

KS: Congratulations!

AC: Thank you.

CB: I had a student who contacted me recently looking for it, and he said he couldn’t find it anywhere. Did he get in touch with you?

AC: I don’t know. I had several—several people since the publisher and the distributor ran out—a number of people have contacted me.

CB: Okay.

AC: And I just got off a boat yesterday, so I have not caught up fully on emails.

CB: Yeah. Well, I hope you do another print run or something at some point, cuz it was a great, great book and a great resource. So, yeah, hopefully, it stays in circulation. Although it’s good for us that have that super-rare, first edition then.

AC: Yeah, yeah. You can maybe sell it and buy three of the second edition.

CB: Right. That’s not a bad idea. All right—

AC: Yeah, we’re thinking about whether we’re gonna do a second print run or a second edition and when and all that. So that’s in process. I don’t intend it to be out of print for terribly long.

KS: Yeah.

CB: And then you have another possible publication in the works as well at some point.

AC: Yeah, I’ve got a couple of small projects, but really I’ve been thinking for most of the last year about putting together a ‘mansions’ book, parallel in some ways to the way that the ‘decans’ book was constructed. You know, maybe a hundred pages of history and then a look at different systems and—how should we say—where they cohere and where they differ, and also putting in some material about how to use them natally and electionally.

CB: Brilliant, all right.

KS: Fantastic!

CB: That would be great. So that actually might be a good segue into the initial discussion topic, where usually I have an initial discussion topic at the top of these forecast episodes to give us something to talk about. It’s not just the forecast that’s going on in the astrological community that we’re thinking about and discussing recently. So the main thing that’s happening right now in the astrological community that I’ve been noticing over the past few weeks—and I don’t know how closely you guys have been following it—but there’s been all this controversy regarding this lecture that Glenn Perry gave in India, where there was this big conference in India; it was hosted by an Indian astrological organization. A bunch of Western astrologers went there and were invited to give talks and lectures, and they did and it was a big success. But one of the main things that people heard about afterwards was that there was this big controversy because Glenn Perry went there and gave a talk basically just saying that the tropical zodiac is the one ‘true’ zodiac and that the sidereal zodiac is false. And he was saying this to like a room full of Indian astrologers who all use the sidereal zodiac, and the video or the lecture—the recording of this talk—was actually just finally released last week. Have you guys seen it? Or have you guys been following this at all? Do you care?

AC: I think I saw that controversy was beginning just before I left, but I’ve been blessedly free of controversy for approximately a week-and-a-half. I guess ‘welcome back’—

CB: Right.

AC: —with the latest drama.

CB: Welcome back to land, and here’s controversy in the astrological community, or another one.

KS: Yeah, I missed it. I seem to really be late to the ‘controversial’ party every time there’s a controversy, and then I’m like scrambling around like, “What’s going on?” I’m like the dazed kid in the corner, reading a book, or some trashy magazine. I don’t want to sound intelligent cuz I’m usually just distracted.

CB: Right.

KS: But I’m intrigued. Because what you’re describing, Chris—just someone to go to a country where a particular style or technique is practiced and basically just—you can totally have a difference of opinion. Knowing this person’s style, it maybe wasn’t done delicately or with any sense of respect. It sounds like it was kind of disrespectful what you’re talking about.

CB: Yeah. I mean, the gist of it was that it came off as totally disrespectful and kind of tactless. I finally actually watched the lecture the other day—I had been putting it off for a while—and, yeah, it was a pretty tactless lecture. And what’s funny is he also—I have major issues with him going back 10 years, when he periodically writes these attacks on different forms of astrology. And 10 years ago, my introduction to him was he wrote this long, like 18-page-long attack on traditional and Hellenistic astrology in the ISAR Journal. And I read it and it was just like littered with all of these errors and misconceptions and things that made it clear that he hadn’t really studied the thing that he was attacking very closely. He was just proceeding from a perspective of he found an approach that works for him—which is modern, psychological astrology—and he assumes that all of the other approaches are wrong. So then periodically—so he attacks traditional astrology. He attacked evolutionary astrology. Now he’s going after sidereal astrology, and they’re often these very poorly-constructed arguments. So in this case the issue was not so much making an argument—since all three of us are tropical astrologers, and we could all have our different arguments for whatever approach we prefer—but it’s more a matter of respect and going to a foreign country and how you respect the Western astrological community, as well as the organization that he’s a part of, which is ISAR, and other things like that, and it was not very good. And that seems to be the general consensus, because basically all of the Western astrologers, or the vast majority of Western astrologers, seemed to be upset with this, and it’s causing—and that’s where the controversy is coming from. He’s gotten a lot of blowback from this lecture.

KS: Sorry, Austin, you go ahead.

AC: No, go ahead.

KS: I was just gonna say it’s almost what you were saying before, Austin, about trying to put two astrologers in a ring—it doesn’t work, which side, which zodiac is better or worse. You’re almost showing a little bit of an ignorance or a lack of knowledge around the philosophy behind each of the different zodiacs and how they came about and why they were used, when and where they were used. And I don’t—I mean, I don’t know if this is something that we three all have in common, or if you guys think differently, but it’s not so much that there’s ‘a right and an only one way’ of astrology. There’s different ‘astrologies’ that grew up in different cultures, based on different philosophies at the time. Not to say that there’s a different astrology everywhere in the world. I don’t know, I think you’re almost coming from the wrong point to say, “This one works and that one doesn’t.”

AC: Yeah. And so, I mean, I think this is part of where we’re at culturally in general, but also specifically in astrology, where we understand that we have to accept that there are ways of doing things that are different than ours, and that a good default response is to respect other ways of doing things. And yet, not every single way of doing things is equally valid, right? And this is part of the challenge of—how should we say—constantly ‘globalizing’ culture. And so, we do need to—if I stick the zodiac in let’s say instead of Ayanamsa or an offset between the two zodiacs, I just arbitrarily decide it’s gonna be 12, right, that’s probably not going to work as well as the tropical or the sidereal, right? And so, we could throw Austin’s ‘Ayanamsa of 12’ out, right? And so, there are things that we need to throw out. So that’s, I don’t know—I think that’s just where we’re at. We’re sort of between respect but not everything is a completely flat plane of qualities. Some things do work better.

KS: That’s true.

AC: And then in some cases there’s the matter of ‘hammers versus saws’, where a saw and a hammer are both good tools. But if you try to hammer with a saw, it will work poorly, and if you try to saw with a hammer, it will also work poorly. So, I don’t know.

CB: Yeah. I mean, that’s one of the great crises of our time in the astrological community—after the revival of all these older forms of astrology, greater interest in Indian astrology in the West, and basically this great diversity in the astrological tradition that’s occurring today—this question of when is it just a matter of recognizing and appreciating and seeing the value in different approaches; different approaches that just might be different approaches that are still effective in different ways. And the common analogy that people usually have invoked in those instances is of astrology as a language, and that question that Rob Hand poses of, “Which is more correct, French or German?” And you realize then—if you phrase it like that—that that might be a false dichotomy to attempt to set it up that way if there can be equally-valid, but just different ways of communicating. So on the one hand there’s that as a scenario, where there may be some instances where that really is the case. And I think all of us would agree in studying different traditions of astrology that each of them have unique and often useful things to say that you can learn from them, that do validate to some extent the ‘language’ analogy. But then on the other hand you do sometimes have this issue with due to the diversity of techniques, sometimes individual astrologers do have to test and attempt to validate one technique or another, or compare one approach to another. Whether it comes to zodiac issues, whether it comes to house division or other things like that, to the extent that astrology’s like a technical discipline, it’s okay to compare and contrast, and in some instances, to decide that you personally think that one approach is more effective for what you’re trying to do than the other.

And I guess that’s where it comes down to. There becomes this issue where I think—I don’t think most people took issue with the idea that Glenn liked the tropical zodiac, was endorsing it, and wanted to promote it and explain why. It was just that the context and the way that he did it to the audience that he chose to do it to was wildly inappropriate. And this question of if we do have this diversity of different astrological traditions and approaches—how do we approach dialogues and discussions, and sometimes debates, with each other? And do we do that respectfully and with an open sense of inquiry and genuine curiosity? Or do we just walk into a room and give each other the middle finger and say, “I’m right and you’re wrong, deal with it?” and is that really productive in any real sense?

KS: I mean, I don’t think it’s productive at all, and it’s divisive, essentially. You know, as you were saying, we can all—we can disagree. We can all have our own interpretation of the different techniques or what have you. Just as we were saying before, even about things like progressions and releasing, they’re all great techniques, but we’re not all using all of them. And for me personally—this is where I think I do have a lot of Venus in my chart—I’m always like, “You can do it your way, that’s okay. And we don’t have to agree, but we could still go out for dinner together.” But that’s not the vibe that comes through in this sort of situation. It’s like you’ve either gotta ‘do it my way or get out of the room’ kind of thing. And I probably have more of an issue with that style of approach to disagreement than I do even necessarily about the substance, if that makes sense.

CB: Right, right. And I don’t know—were you gonna say anything else about this, Austin?

AC: Oh, I guess one thing, because I’ve been spending a fair amount of time with Jyotish lately.

CB: With Indian astrology.

AC: Yeah. And one of the—one way that I’ve been thinking about this difference lately is in part inspired by Jyotish. And that is when you’re looking at particular chart pattern—like a yoga, like a chart pattern that indicates a particular quality of character or life, right—when you’re looking for one of these, in addition to looking at the natal chart from the ascendant, you would also look to see—for some of you—you would look to see whether it recurs by house from the perspective of the Sun is rising. Or, excuse me, the Sun treated as rising, or the Moon as rising, and then you would look to see whether it recurs in certain divisional charts. And so, you know, the idea is that although the natal with the ascendant is sort of the ‘master’ chart, you check the opinion of a great number of other charts to confirm or deny the pattern that you’re seeing. And so, it seems natural—I’ve sort of have come into a habit of just looking to see whether a particular chart pattern recurs in both the natal—in both the tropical and the sidereal natal, as well as these others. Does that make sense?

CB: Sure. Yeah, definitely. And, I mean, that’s one of the questions then. It’s like that’s a solution and that’s a possible solution to this issue. And it seems like different astrologers develop different solutions when presented with this problem and that sort of dialogue that develops around it.

AC: Yeah. And I wouldn’t be so final as to call it an answer or a solution. It’s more—it’s more sort of like a working approach at this point in time, because I’m not willing to trash one so I can just do the other; so I can just do one and then trash the other. And so, that’s just sort of like if we’re going to say these are probably both valid, how do we—how do we then work with that assumption, right? And that’s sort of where I’m at today.

CB: Right. Well, and one of the things that you’re actually doing is you’re actually studying Indian astrology in order to understand how the sidereal zodiac has been used in that context in the process. And that is something that Glenn didn’t do cuz he thinks Indian astrology is dumb, because he thinks traditional astrology is dumb. And he doesn’t have any qualms about attacking those traditions before studying them, basically is the recurring theme.

AC: Yeah. Well, and if you’re going to go through the bother of critiquing something, you need to get to know it very well.

CB: Right, theoretically.

AC: Yeah. Well, it’s almost like the bad attacks on astrology where they’re like, “The zodiacs change, y’all.” We’re like, “Yes, we know. We’re using the tropical zodiac.”

CB: Right.

AC: Like that’s not a critique.

CB: They proceed assuming that astrologers aren’t aware of precession or don’t know what they’re doing.

AC: Right. You know, in Indian astrology, they do know about precession. This isn’t like a truth bomb that anyone has dropped.

CB: Right.

AC: It’s in very old texts where they’re just like, “We’re not using that. This is a thing. This is the yearly zodiac. We’re doing—we’re using a different tool for this job.”

CB: Right. Well, even skeptics commonly allege that astrologers don’t know about precession, even though there’s been so many famous astronomers down through history that used the tropical zodiac and were very aware of precession—from Ptolemy to Kepler to Galileo or what have you.

AC: Right. Galileo didn’t know about precession.

CB: Right. Yeah, anyway, so somebody in our live audience of patrons just gave the link to the transcript of Glenn’s talk, but I actually would not recommend reading the transcript. Because he tried to promote the transcript early on when the controversy first erupted, and everybody on Facebook started hearing all these complaints that he had given this really offensive lecture in India. And so, one of his strategies was to release a transcript right at the start. But the transcript’s actually misleading because he actually had a bunch of subtle things—including a bunch of images—in his slides that you actually need to see in the video in order to understand the true effect of the talk. So I would not recommend actually just watching the transcript. One of the slides—actually the very first diagram he used in the talk when he first starts explaining the difference between the sidereal and tropical zodiacs—was actually an image that he ripped off from an article that I wrote on my website. So that was actually an interesting—

KS: That would have really annoyed you to see.

CB: Yeah. Especially given my history with him, and him writing that attack on traditional astrology 10 years ago, and me writing a long response to it, where I pointed out all of the mistakes that demonstrated that he hadn’t studied traditional astrology before attacking it. So I’ve actually done a follow-up for this talk. Now that I’ve watched it—and I recorded a two-hour commentary discussion/analysis of his lecture last night—I’m trying to decide whether to release it right now. So if I decide to do so, I’ll do so sometime in the next few days. So that may or may not be an episode of the podcast coming up soon, and then we can—I’m sure that’ll lead to further discussions.

KS: Totally.

CB: All right, so let’s move on. Oh, yeah, the only other piece of news is that the Regulus Award voting just closed today actually. So I don’t know if you guys—do you get ballots? Are you guys members of those orgs?

AC: I think so.

KS: I did.

AC: I believe I am. I’ve been kind of out of it. I mean, I was—I’ve been geographically out of it, and the previous two months were one long work bender, so I might have ignored those emails in favor of more pressing matters.

KS: Yes.

CB: All right.

KS: Austin and I were talking about how insane the Mars-Jupiter in Scorpio combo was for both of us work-wise. Yeah, I just voted the other week. Cuz I’m actually a member of two different orgs, so I got to vote twice, but I just voted for the same people twice. I don’t know if that’s legal or not. I didn’t really think it was—I don’t know, maybe it’s not. But I figured I was—

CB: No.

KS: I pay two memberships. I should have two votes.

CB: Yeah, I think that’s how it’s supposed to work is if you have multiple memberships, you end up getting a vote for each organization who’s separately—

KS: Yeah. Cuz I got ISAR and AFAN, and I voted cuz I’m a member of both of those organizations. And that’s just my ‘joiner’ mentality, which I learned a lot about when I discussed with Austin his Mars. I always feel like you’re ‘so Mars’ sometimes. And all your analogies are like, “Two boxers in a ring,” and all my analogies are like, “When I’m in the kitchen baking,” and it’s just so different.

CB: Right.

AC: To be fair, Kait and I binged all four seasons of The Great British Baking Show last month. And in my consultations for the following weeks every one of my analogies was about picking great British baking—

KS: Austin, I’m thrilled! I wish I was a fly on the wall to hear you give baking analogies. But anyway, Chris was asking us about the Regulus Awards and our tangents are clearly on fire today. So, yes, I did vote. There were some good categories. I saw, Chris, that you were nominated.

CB: Yeah.

KS: And I won’t discuss whether I voted for you or not because voting is private.

CB: Right. Yeah, I was actually nominated for a Regulus Award.

KS: Which is huge. You must be like the youngest person ever. So for people who might not know, these are like the ‘astrological Oscars’, basically.

CB: Yeah. I mean, it’s the biggest award that we basically have in the astrological community, because it’s put together on behalf of all three or four of the major astrological organizations in the US. So it doesn’t really get bigger than that. So I was nominated in the category for Theory and Understanding of Astrology. Although what’s funny is the other nominees were Benjamin Dykes who’s done two million translations of Medieval, ancient astrological texts, James Holden who’s written the standard books on the history of astrology, as well as translated several dozen ancient astrological texts, Deborah Houlding who has the most popular and extensive website on traditional astrology on the internet, and then Adam Gainsburg who’s done some amazing work on observational astronomy and things like the Venus and Mars cycles. So the competition was actually pretty tough.

KS: That was actually I think one of the categories that had the most high-quality candidates in it.

CB: Yeah, and I felt bad. And I’m actually only mentioning it now on the podcast, now that voting is over, because I didn’t want to influence it or game it unduly, because I actually feel almost bad that I’m going up against Ben and Houlding and Holden. And I would almost feel bad if I won the award instead of James Holden or Benjamin Dykes or Deborah Houlding on some level.

KS: Yes.

AC: Well, that’s what we like about you, Chris. You have integrity.

KS: Yes.

CB: Sure. So anyway it’ll be interesting to see—

AC: Sure.

CB: Yeah, yeah, sure. Whatever. So weirdly though, I did notice that in my transits, that transiting Jupiter’s exactly conjoining to the minute my natal Mercury today. And it’s kinda weird that the voting is closing at the same time. So I don’t know. We’ll see how that pans out.

KS: Oh, and actually what Jupiter’s doing in your natal chart—I know other people who have won awards under that kind of cycle.

AC: Well, and Jupiter’s basically going to station in that degree.

KS: Correct.

CB: Right.

KS: Yeah, it’s there now for like a month.

CB: Sure. So that’s actually a good segue then into the point of our discussion today, which is—

KS: That was a very smooth segue.

CB: Right.

AC: Also, the Moon is exactly trine that Jupiter—

KS: Right now.

AC: —while we’re talking, like within two minutes of arc.

CB: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it just closed, and they’re literally just counting up the votes today. So it’s actually interesting, cuz I’ve never paid attention to something like that, where it’s a vote process, where you know the results aren’t gonna come out until months later. But technically, today, the vote has closed, and therefore, all of the votes that will get in are now officially being counted as of today. So it’s sort of an interesting astrological thing to think about in terms of the vote closing and potentially people who win the awards having transits that day, that they don’t find out about until months later. But we’ll see what happens. All right, so let’s make a transition then into talking about the forecast for March. So we’re already at March. So what is today? It’s February 26, 2018. I’m gonna go ahead and share the chart for the moment, just so that those who are following the video version of this can kind of see the lineup of planets that we’re looking at right now. But where should we start in terms of the astrological forecast for March? Or what do you guys think is sort of important that we should start with? Should we just start at the top of the month?

AC: The Full Moon on the 1st, right?

KS: Yeah, there’s a Full Moon. Very easy place to start for this month.

CB: Very easy place.

KS: And this is gonna be a month where there’s gonna be a Blue Moon. And I’ve already started to tell people, “Please don’t ask me about this.”

CB: Oh, yeah, that’s you guys’ most hated thing, the concept of the Blue Moon.

KS: Yeah.

AC: It’s in the ‘book of grudges’.

KS: Yeah.

AC: I don’t know if it’s at the top.

KS: It might not be at the top, but it’s definitely in the book, definitely. Because we have a Full Moon about every 29 days, so there’s sometimes where the calendar months correspond and we just have two per calendar month. And March is one of those months.

CB: Okay.

KS: Yeah—

CB: So we’ve got a Full Moon—

KS: —that’s a Virgo Full Moon.

CB: —on the 1st. Full Moon on the 1st in Virgo, and then a Full Moon on the very last day of the month in Libra, basically.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Got it. Okay. So starting—go ahead, Austin.

AC: I was just gonna say one introductory comment about March this year. Many of you have probably heard the old saying, “In like a lion, out like a lamb,” referring to the weather in March. This year it’s ‘in like a lamb and out like a lion’. Things get steadily less chill—

KS: Yes.

AC: —as the month progresses. Although they start pretty chill.

KS: Yes. Yeah, it’s interesting. My one-sentence summary for March is ‘it’s a month in two-parts’.

AC: Absolutely.

KS: So there is the first-half of March and then there is the second-half of March, and they’re very different.

CB: What’s the major—just to give us a preview—what’s the major—

KS: Oh, yeah.

CB: —distinction?

KS: Well, I think it’s the shift of primarily Mars into Capricorn on the 17th, I think—if I’ve got that date right—mid-month. And then we also have a Mercury retrograde start at the end of the month. We’ve got so much Pisces energy at the start of the month; we’re all in the pool and we’re happy cuz the Sun is shining. But then we get the segue with Mercury and Venus going into Aries. But it’s primarily the Mars split that I think really changes the vibe—

AC: Yeah—go ahead. Yeah, everything goes from ‘water’ in Jupiter to ‘fire’ in Mars.

KS: ‘Fire’ Mars and Saturn

CB: Right. Right, that makes a lot of sense. We have everything in Pisces. And then, very quickly, all those inner planets start shifting into Aries. And at the same time we get Mars not just shifting into Capricorn, but going into Capricorn, where it meets up with Saturn pretty soon after and starts getting ready to turn retrograde before too long, later in the year as well.

AC: Yeah. Well, and we just have—Mars’ ingress into Capricorn, which puts it into a two-month co-presence with Saturn and Pluto, is quite significant, but it is made all the more significant because shortly after Mars’ ingress, the Sun moves into Mars-ruled Aries. Venus is already in Mars-ruled Aries, and Mercury stations retrograde in Mars-ruled Aries. So a lot of planets are ‘answering’ to Mars at the same time as Mars is closing in on a rather gnarly conjunction with Saturn.

CB: Wow. Yeah, that is pretty striking.

KS: Yes. And that conjunction technically becomes exact early in April, but we’re gonna be feeling it through those last sort of 10 or 12 days of March, as soon as Mars gets into Capricorn, basically.

AC: We can contrast that very meaningfully with the beginning of the month, which has the Sun, Mercury, Venus, and Neptune in Jupiter-ruled Pisces.

CB: Right. So that’s where we’re at right now and what we’re coming out of. And so, we have at the top of the month—like you guys said, starting with that Full Moon in Virgo—the Full Moon takes place at 11° of Virgo. The closest aspect that it’s actually tied into is the Moon being opposite to Neptune at 13° of Pisces, and the Sun conjunct Neptune at 13° of Pisces. So is that the main signature? It looks like that’s one of the main signatures, aside from a pretty nice-looking trine between Venus and Mercury at about 22-23 Pisces, with Jupiter at 23 Scorpio. So this is the contrast that you guys were talking about in terms of the sort of ease of the beginning of the month versus some of the more ‘Martian’ and other hard aspects later in the month.

AC: Absolutely.

KS: Definitely.

CB: Okay. And that actually brings me to the election. Because when Leisa was looking for auspicious electional charts this month, she was actually having kind of a hard time, but she found one at the very beginning of the month that we wanted to highlight for this month. Because I think basically she picked up on the same thing that you guys did, which is basically that the first month—part of the month—looks a lot easier than the second part of the month, and therefore, the best electional chart that we wanted to highlight actually takes place right away on March 1. So here is the chart for that on the screen. So the chart is set for—so the chart’s set for March 1, 2018, starting at—the election is set for 6:49 PM in Denver, Colorado, or whatever your location is, basically. You can set it for local time.

KS: Oh, perfect, yeah.

CB: You don’t have to convert it. So what you want to do is set the chart so that approximately 23° of Virgo is rising in your area—whatever city you live in on the Earth—on March 1 of 2018, and then you’ll get approximately the same chart as what we have here. So, interestingly, I mean, this is basically the same Full Moon chart that we were talking about, at least here in Denver. It takes place just after or shortly after the Full Moon. And the point of this election primarily was to take advantage of that Mercury-Venus-Jupiter trine that we were talking about just a second ago—which is so auspicious right at the start of the month, around the time of the Full Moon—and to make sure that the Moon itself is partially applying to those aspects. So the Moon is in the first whole sign house at 11° of Virgo, and it’s applying somewhat widely to the sextile with Jupiter at 23° of Scorpio, and then eventually the opposition with Venus and Mercury at 22°-23° of Pisces. So the other thing about this election is that it has Virgo rising, with Mercury ruling the ascendant, and it’s placed in Pisces, in the seventh whole sign house, which is not amazing in terms of zodiacal strength. But what it is very good for is Mercury is applying next to a trine—a very close trine—with Jupiter at 23° of Scorpio with reception, which then heightens or strengthens the connection between Mercury and Jupiter. And then after Mercury completes that trine with Jupiter, it then moves on to attempt to form a conjunction with Venus.

Yeah, so one of the important things about this chart is you need to make sure it’s a night chart. So this is set so that it takes place shortly after sunset. But it’s actually very crucial that you make sure that the Sun has already set and it’s well below the horizon by the time you do this election. So that’s why we set the ascendant at 23° of Virgo. By making it a night chart, you neutralize Mars, which is otherwise angular in the fourth whole sign house down in Sagittarius. But as long as you ensure that it’s a night chart, that should not be a major problematic factor, because Mercury is separating from the square with Mars, and then applying to the trine with Jupiter. And Mars in a night chart is not as problematic as it would be in a day chart. And, additionally, putting—making it a night chart also makes Venus a bit more positive as well, which in this chart is angular, and is set to be very prominent in the seventh whole sign house, right on the degree of the descendant. So, basically, if you look at the visual astronomy on the day that you do this election what’ll happen is that you’ll do the election shortly after sunset. And right at that time all of the stars will come out, and you’ll see Venus setting on the horizon. So Venus will set as a little twinkling star shortly after the Sun does, and at the same time, the Full Moon will be rising over the eastern horizon, over the ascendant at that time. So you’re basically taking a lot of the most positive things of that Full Moon at the very start of the month, on March 1, and then using it as an electional chart. So, yeah, that’s the election for March. What do you guys think?

KS: I think the best—one of the best things happening this March is the Venus-Jupiter trine. So getting that in is juicy.

CB: Yeah.

AC: Yeah, I think that’s nice. There’s a lot to work with under that configuration. I could see for specific purposes I think the Virgo rising is fine. But I could see for specific purposes turning the wheel a little bit if you wanted to really focus on one particular house. Because there’s a lot of benefic happening there.

KS: Yes.

AC: And so, if you’re proficient I think you could get a couple different elections that night out of it, again, depending if you really wanted to focus on sort of a single-house election rather than a general election. But, yeah, it’s juicy. And, you know, Mercury—Mercury is in trouble in Pisces, in its fall, but it is dignified by both benefics simultaneously, which is a pretty nice thing. You know, that’s as much help as a planet can get.

CB: Yeah.

KS: Yes.

CB: It’s one of those instances where it’s like you have that standard statement that everybody learns when they first learn traditional astrology and first learns the dignity system that some planets do better or are more auspiciously-placed in some signs, and they’re less auspiciously-placed in other signs. But there’s always that proviso that there can be major mitigating factors that can allow the planets to still function pretty effectively and pretty auspiciously in those signs as long as you have certain things present. And for the most part this has such significant offsetting factors that I don’t think it’s a major issue using Mercury in Pisces as the ruler of the ascendant because it has such a strong relationship with Jupiter and Venus.

AC: Mm-hmm.

CB: Yeah. Anyway, so that’s the election for March. Leisa found a few other electional charts—it was actually kind of tough to find good elections this month, especially in the second-half of the month. But she found three others, and we’re gonna talk about those charts on the Auspicious Elections Podcast, which we’re gonna release in the next few days for patrons on the $5 and $10 tiers through our page on Patreon. So you can check that out for more information. All right, so that’s the beginning of the month. We’re still basically just talking about—literally just talking about the 1st of the month at this point. So what’s the next thing that we should talk about? Or what should we move onto from here?

KS: Well, and we’ve talked about the Venus-Jupiter trine, which is nice. Austin?

AC: Oh, I was just gonna say we didn’t really characterize the Full Moon—

KS: The Full Moon.

AC: —in and of itself. We talked about how it anchors some good elections. But I think it’s worth a minute to just say, “Okay, we’ve got a Full Moon in Virgo opposite all these things in Pisces.” I see that as an opportunity and perhaps the necessity for balancing out. If you’ve got—if you let things get a little, how should we say, a little Pisces ‘sloppy’, that Full Moon in Virgo is very helpful for kind of just maintaining minimal order. Making sure that, yes, that’s wonderful you’re having a good time, but let’s remember to pick up after ourselves, and remember the bills are still due, even if you’re kind of relaxing and enjoying yourself. It’s, you know, sort of a useful counterpoint to what is somewhat ‘excessive’ Pisces at the beginning of the month.

CB: Right.

KS: Yes.

CB: Yeah, definitely. I mean, everything does seem to lead back to both Pisces and Neptune as being like the dominant signatures it seems like for this Full Moon. Which is weird because even though it’s a Virgo Full Moon, it’s like the ruler of Virgo, Mercury, is in Pisces trining Jupiter and conjoining Venus and separating from conjunction with Neptune. And the next aspect that the Moon makes immediately after leaving the opposition with the Sun is that opposition with Neptune itself. And that was actually one of Leisa’s major reservations about using that election or highlighting it this month—the fact that the Moon, before it makes it to the benefics, to Jupiter and Venus, it hits Neptune, and that question of would you use something, or when do you go ahead and do something when you know you’re gonna run into a bit of a ‘Neptunian’ barrier. What does a ‘Neptunian’ barrier look like in some instances where you have to get through that in order to get to the other side?

AC: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I would probably avoid using this for something that is excruciatingly mercurial, right? If the primary—if the primary nature of the act requires precision, speed, analysis, if that is the most important thing—all of which are mercurial qualities—I would maybe not. But if—

CB: Right. If you’re like editing a book or like writing computer code or something like that.

AC: Right. But, you know, if it’s any less exacting than that it should be just fine. I just wouldn’t put the mercurial—yeah, if it’s excruciating mercurial then I wouldn’t use this, but it’s good for a lot of other things. Yeah, just—

KS: Yeah—sorry, go, Austin.

AC: I was just gonna say and just because something has a mercurial component doesn’t mean it’s primarily mercurial, right? You know, for example, writing poetry involves writing. But poetry is much more than simply mercurial. It’s really primarily Venusian. And so, that would be fine. You know, if you were writing—if you were doing something that requires imagination, right, and perspective and artistry, then this is perfect for that. But if you’re writing—yeah, again, I think computer code is a good example of maybe not, Chris, as well as if you’re doing your taxes. This isn’t the best ‘doing your taxes’ election.

CB: Right. Yeah. And that’s a really important distinction for elections that people sometimes get caught up on. They really need to figure out what is the underlying essence of what you’re actually trying to do, or what’s actually involved here rather than sometimes people get distracted about some other part that’s involved and mistake that as like the main emphasis.

AC: Yeah. Like with this one, I would say lead with Venus. This would be best for Venusian elections and sufficient for a number of others.

KS: Yeah. I mean, it just strikes me that with the rulers of the 1st and the 7th also kind of applying, that this would be really good for a relationship, romantic-type election.

AC: Date night.

KS: Yeah, date night, for sure. If you’re writing something creative. But I do like the energy of the Virgo Moon just creating that polarity with the Piscean energy. If nothing else it’s like let’s just focus for a couple of days and maybe achieve a couple of points that will help feed the ‘Piscean’ dream, but will be substantial or tangible. There’ll be some sort of productive output here. So I think that’s a nice counteract—counterpoint, too. I mean, the Virgo Moon is always a nice counterpoint to Piscean energy. But this year we’ve got an excess of Piscean energy while that Virgo Moon happens that we don’t always have.

CB: Right. And that’s such a, and it’s such a—it becomes more stark or more clear—or will become more clear what that is and how it’s different once we get to like the second-half of the month, where everything’s suddenly in like Aries and Capricorn and you get much more of a hard edge, and sort of the nebulousness and the sort of romance of Pisces is kind of over at that point.

KS: Gone. So if you’re enjoying it, enjoy it while it lasts, cuz I think it’s actually around the 6th of March that Mercury and Venus do move in. Mercury goes first, I think, and then Venus follows into Aries.

AC: Mm-hmm.

CB: Brilliant.

AC: But I would just say—so we’ve got the Virgo Full Moon on the 1st. The Moon is still in Virgo on the 2nd. On the 3rd and 4th, we have a Libra Moon, a Venus-ruled Libra Moon. And during that time we have Sun conjunct Neptune in Pisces, and Mercury conjunct Venus—

KS: Yes.

AC: —in Pisces. So it’s almost like that ‘hyper’ Pisces Venusian period extends right up until the end of the Libra Moon, which follows the Virgo Moon. And then Mercury and Venus both bail on Pisces and enter into Aries, beginning the shift into the more fiery and Mars-ruled portion of the month. But at that point it’s somewhat balanced, right? We’ve got some fire, we’ve got some water, it’s not—it’s not as lopsided as the very beginning of the month, which is lopsided towards water, or the end of the month, which is very ‘hot and dry/earth and air’ Mars, Mars, Mars.

KS: Yes.

CB: Right. So that’s our next major astronomical movement. March 6, basically on the same day, we get the—not quite simultaneous—but at least on the same day, or within the same 24-hour period, ingress of Mercury and then Venus into Aries.

AC: Yeah. And it’s worth nothing that Mercury and Venus are right next to each other for the entirety of the month, more or less.

CB: That is interesting. Cuz Mercury’s actually getting ready—

KS: Slowing down.

CB: —to slow down to station retrograde.

AC: Yeah. They’ll both be—they should both be visible for just a little bit after sunset together.

KS: Yes. I mean, that is one of the astronomical shifts coming into March, too, isn’t it? That Venus starts to become visible again after being hidden for quite some time.

AC: Right. And they’re both getting—they’re both actually getting further and further from the Sun. So they’ll be getting more and more visible for most of the month until Mercury pauses for its retrograde station and then begins to drop back beneath the horizon.

KS: Yes. And Venus will carry on further. But Venus is moving relatively quickly right now, so she can keep pace with Mercury.

AC: And Mercury is slowing down.

KS: He’s slowing down. So they’re more—yeah, they’re running together. But I think the shift—so Mercury and Venus, I always think of planets moving out of Pisces and into Aries, it’s like they start to dry out. So the inspiration or the feeling or the intuition or the creativity, that starts to subside. And once we get into Aries of course we’re more about taking action. There’s more of a decisive quality. Not necessarily saying that Mercury going into shadow is super-decisive, but there are a few days there when Mercury just gets into Aries, before it hits what will be the start of the technical shadow point. So there’s a little bit of like, okay, make those decisions, start putting plans into action. We want some movement. We’re no longer dreaming. We’ve got our shoes on, and we’re heading out, getting things done.

AC: Yeah, definitely. You know, when I think of the Pisces/Aries cusp, I always think of that evolutionary scene where the fish with bony fins kind of like clomps up onto land. You guys remember that—

KS: That’s a great image, yeah.

AC: —from science class?

KS: Yeah.

AC: I’m not sure if that’s the way it happened, but I remember that image. And it’s sort of awkward at first, but give it a million years, right—

KS: Yeah. Yes.

AC: —and that fish will grow horns.

KS: But it’s a nice concept, cuz the expression of that planet evolves as it changes signs.

AC: Yeah.

KS: Yeah. And the flip side is wherever Aries is in your chart, you’ve now got the presence of Mercury and Venus before we get to head up with what Mars is doing, so a little bit of a—

AC: So just a bit about—and so, technically, we have two Mercury-Venus conjunctions this month. We have one in Pisces, and we have one in Aries.

KS: Yes.

AC: And I personally like Mercury-Venus conjunctions quite a bit. I find the writing comes much easier, and also, often the speaking.

KS: Yes.

AC: In this particular one, Venus is the stronger of the two while they’re in Pisces. And then Mercury’s—Mercury’s a little bit more ‘fit’ in Aries, as Venus tends to find Aries a little bit irritating. There’s some chaffing with the martial nature of Aries with Venus there. It’s the traditional detriment. But the two are good for, I don’t know, polishing your silver tongue or doing some—doing some nice writing. Doesn’t have to be absurdly poetic, but something where a little bit of an aesthetic edge is appropriate.

CB: One of the examples I always like to use, and I used in my book, is that the poet TS Elliott has a Venus-Mercury conjunction right on the degree of his ascendant in Libra—or had a Venus-Mercury conjunction right on the degree of his ascendant in Libra. I always thought that was a good metaphor for that and the sort of poetry that comes along with Venus and Mercury that you’re talking about here.

AC: Yeah. I believe that Clive Barker also has a Mercury-Venus conjunction in Libra. Although I think we’re not so sure about his—his birth time. But he’s—even though he’s a horror writer, he has a very luxurious and poetic style of prose.

KS: And I think that’s the key thing here with Mercury-Venus in aspect—is that it adds that magnetic, sweet, ‘I want more’ quality of Venus to the Mercury, which is the words or the prose, whether it’s written or spoken. Cuz I do find the same thing, Austin. Mercury-Venus—the conjunction or the sextile—can be great. I mean, it’s a lovely signature in a natal chart for that artistry or that way with words or that creative, crafting component. And I hadn’t quite pulled it together the way you are sharing here that Mercury and Venus are gonna basically skip along together for this month, which just makes that energy available to all of us.

AC: Yeah. So one thing that just occurred to me, just from the reversed point of view, not what Mercury—or not what Venus offers to Mercury, but what Mercury offers to Venus. Mercury offers a technical perspective to ‘artistic’ Venus.

KS: That’s beautiful. Yeah.

AC: I was just thinking about this because Kait, my wife, has been working on learning piano, and my dad was telling—my dad’s learning a new style of guitar. And I was like, “Oh, that’s the technical—those are the technical requirements you need to install and internalize before you can make the beautiful music.”

KS: That’s a really good point. And the same with writing. That you have to know how to put sentences together or how to use words before you can create a piece of writing that is pleasing to read or pleasing to hear.

AC: Yeah. Yeah, so both sides, right?

KS: Yeah!

AC: If somebody wants to—you know, if you wanted to start learning an instrument, or you want to get back to learning an instrument, a Mercury-Venus conjunction election would be a great time to do that, cuz that’s about the union of those two principles.

CB: Sure. So we’ve got—it looks like the first Mercury-Venus conjunction occurs around March 3. And that one’s interesting cuz Mercury is moving faster than Venus, and Mercury overtakes Venus at about 26° of—26°-27° of Pisces—and then that’s around March 3-March 4. And then later in the month they both go into Aries, and then Mercury starts slowing down while Venus is still speeding up, and Venus actually ends up catching up to Mercury and overtakes Mercury. It looks like that takes place, what, about March 19-March 20, at about 16° of Aries.

KS: Yeah, cuz Mercury’s just in station then, and Venus hotfoots it over Mercury.

CB: Okay, right. So that’s actually the stationary—the degree that Mercury stations at is 16° by about March 22-March 23. But Venus has already conjoined Venus basically in that degree, back around the 19th.

KS: Yes. Yeah.

CB: Interesting. All right. I mean, that’s interesting in and of itself just in terms of there probably being more of an interpretive difference. Obviously that comes up very clearly in horary astrology where it matters which planet is applying to which planet, or which planet’s receiving the aspect of which planet. But it’s interesting thinking about—you know, when you read just the ‘cookbook’ astrological discussions, it just gives one delineation for Mercury conjunct Venus. But what is the interpretive distinction between Mercury conjunct Venus, where Mercury applies to and conjoins and overtakes Venus, versus what happens when Venus actually applies to and overtakes Mercury?

AC: Yeah. Well, and also, if we’re looking at it from a horary perspective, you have the two coming together, separating, and then coming back together.

KS: Yeah.

AC: Right? So if you’re looking at a horary chart, you’re like, “Ah! Mercury is separating from Venus.” Not really. Like that’s the space in-between two conjunctions. It’s actually applying while it’s separating.

CB: Right. Cuz if it was like a relationship horary, it’s like, “Will these two people get back together?” or “Will ‘X’ and ‘Y’ individuals reconcile?” and you saw them separating, it might indicate coming back together, then separating, and then coming back together again or something like that, in terms of it describing, symbolically, a sequence of events.

AC: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Exactly.

CB: Interesting. All right. Well, so that’s right at the beginning of the month, and we’re focusing mainly so far on Mercury and Venus. But pretty soon after that another relatively major astronomical event takes place pretty early in like the first week of the month, which is Jupiter stationing retrograde in Scorpio at 23° of that sign, right around March 28-March 29, right?

AC: Mm-hmm.

CB: All right, so this is our first station. It’s now been a few months. It’s been several months at this point since Jupiter ingressed into Scorpio last fall. And now we have Jupiter slowing down and turning retrograde at that point, and it will stay retrograde for the next few months after this.

AC: Yeah. Well, Jupiter’s cycle is just about cut into thirds. You know, we have the conjunction with the Sun, which occurred last November, and then—oh, no, late October—and then you got about four months and then Jupiter stations retrograde. And it’ll be retrograde for a little under four months, then it stations direct, and then you got about four months until the next Sun-Jupiter conjunction. So the middle-third of Jupiter’s cycle is always retrograde. And I think here it might be worth it to just point out for what’s for me the millionth time that Jupiter’s retrograde and direct periods are not analogous to those of Mercury or Venus. Mercury and Venus—the interior planets—in some ways reverse their significations when they’re retrograde. A retrograde Venus will actively create dispute and strife in an area. And Mercury, instead of creating—Mercury, when retrograde, instead of creating clarity will actually—will actively fog things up. Jupiter—as the planet of coherence and opportunity—does not become an indicator of incoherence and calamity when it’s retrograde. You don’t have a reversal. You don’t have that blatant reversal of significations with Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. Their retrogrades are different and occur much more regularly. And so, I wanted to point that out. That retrograde phase is different in quality, but it’s not—it doesn’t turn a benefic into a malefic. Kelly, how do you look at Jupiter’s retrograde phase?

KS: Yeah, look, I think the phase is interesting to note, but I agree with you—it’s something you sorta say to students all the time. Like a Jupiter retrograde or a Saturn retrograde does not have the qualitative difference necessarily that a Mercury or a Venus retrograde, also because Saturn and Jupiter are retrograde a much more substantial portion of their time. So other than the station points themselves—which I think are perhaps more significant—that’s sort of pausing and holding and emphasizing what comes out of those station degree periods. You know, Mercury can be effective when—oh, sorry, not Mercury. Jupiter—I beg your pardon—can be effective when retrograde. It’s the station degrees, I think, where we get some of that significance and that shift. So the station period. So I always like to look at that four- or five-week period, right around when Jupiter is just at 23°, in this instance, which is not just March. I think Jupiter hit 23 in late Feb. And, you know, basically from late Feb to the end of March, Jupiter is just at 22 or 23 Scorpio. You know, I don’t have that worry that some people do. “Oh, my God, Jupiter’s retrograde. The sky is falling.” It’s just going backwards. Like you get a chance to reemphasize. Focus on the house that it’s triggering in your natal chart, or any planets that it might be directly activating.

AC: Yeah. What I often see with the transition from Jupiter direct to retrograde is that Jupiter direct, after it comes off of that conjunction with the Sun, often introduces opportunities either for exterior growth or interior growth or education. And then when it hits the retrograde phase, you’re looking at, shall we say, making good on the opportunities that have introduced themselves, or getting through the tougher parts of a program to educate yourself or to take in new material. And it’s a little—Jupiter retrograde tends to be a little bit more complicated and, how shall we say, progress tends to be a little more curvy, crooked, a little bit less linear, but it’s still a road to ‘Jupiterian’ things. It’s not like a road to ruin.

KS: No.

AC: It doesn’t become the road to Saturn, for example.

KS: No. It does require more of you, perhaps. Particularly Jupiter in Scorpio. I think it’s such a—you know, you’ve really got to either dig deep or to do the work or to make sure there’s substance in there, essentially.

AC: Yeah, totally.

KS: Yeah. I liked what you said, Austin, about the different types of focus of the Jupiter conjunctions with the Sun, based on whether it was direct or retrograde.

AC: Oh, thanks.

KS: Yeah. Nice stuff.

CB: Yeah. And that idea also, I like, that you brought up, Austin—one of the things that it is similar to, where it does import something that’s similar formally from the retrograde cycles of Mercury and Venus that we see is sometimes something happening at the start, like when the planet stations retrograde, or an attempt being made to do something, or the initial effort to do something that isn’t brought to completion, and then is later revisited in some way later on in the year when Jupiter eventually returns back to that degree that it stationed retrograde at. That’s something I see—I have seen especially common with Saturn and Saturn’s retrograde degrees and then returning back to those degrees. Because it’s really just going back over or returning to and reemphasizing something that was already—like a note that was already struck earlier. With Jupiter I think you can see similar themes sometimes. And that doesn’t necessarily have to be a bad thing, but it’s just important for people to pay attention to. If they do have something sensitive that that specific degree is hitting—of 23 Scorpio—any events that take place around the time of that station could end up having a broader, long-term impact than you might anticipate at the time, and you may find yourself revisiting it again later in the year when Jupiter returns back to that degree one more time.

AC: Yeah, totally. And I would just like to add that when we’re looking at Jupiter transits, because Jupiter is a benefic—it is the greater benefic—a lot of times we’re dealing—we’re not dealing quite as much with stuff that just happens to you. Both of the benefics—but Jupiter in particular—often have a more volitional or voluntary quality. You know, if we think about ‘Jupiterian’ figures, or people who exemplify Jupiter, they’re often successful at what they try to do. We can imagine circumstances, like winning the lottery, where good happens to you. But as a default, generally, good is what you create—you are successful in what you intended—and then the bad is stuff that happens to you. I notice sometimes when I’m talking to people about Jupiter transits, they’re like, “Well, nothing good happened to me at that time.” Whereas Saturn is very easy, because Saturn very often happens to you rather than you being the Saturn that happens. Again, you know, we’re talking about growth or education—all these ‘Jupiterian’ significations. These are things that you do, and it’s nice when the world cooperates with you, and that’s part of what Jupiter transits are about. But, you know, Jupiter’s hermetic lot is the Lot of Victory. Victory cannot simply happen to you. You have to try to win, right? And then victory is what happens when you succeed at winning.

KS: Well, and I think it brings up a quote. You know, ‘Jupiter’ people are often described as lucky, or you’re having a Jupiter transit and you’re supposed to be someone who’s blessed by luck. But then there’s this explanation that being lucky is sort of—you know, luck is what happens where opportunity meets effort or preparation. So I totally agree with you, Austin, and I love how we’re sort of basically fleshing out the idea of what a Jupiter transit is. You know, it’s about—there’s an opportunity to collaborate. There’s an opportunity to get things done, where there’s more support or more help, or more offered to you at this time. But it is a good point to keep in mind that if you have a planet around that 22° or 23° mark of Jupiter, there’s three hits to that Jupiter transit, and it won’t complete until the final aspect later in the year. So there’s—there’s a lot in there. But, yeah, it’s a good reminder too about the lot associated with Jupiter is about victory. But victory doesn’t happen to people who stay at home watching TV. Victory is for people who got out there and gave it a shot. And actually—oh, my God—I have a really funny story about this. You know the Winter Olympics that are happening right now?

CB: Yeah.

KS: And Australia is a really ‘summery’ country. And so, I’m always getting questions like, “Do the Australians put a team in at the Olympics—the Winter Olympics?” And I’m like, “Look, we do.” Australians are very good at things like snowboarding the half-pike, like the aerial types of stuff. But then I always throw out, “But, you know, Australia’s won a gold medal in the speed skating, too,” and people look at me like I’ve three heads. “Like, Kelly, you’re having a ‘Piscean’ fit of fantasy here. This cannot be possible.” And like, no, no, we really did. And this is the idea of the luck/opportunity/preparation all coming together. It was maybe 10 years ago—the athlete is named Steve Bradbury—and it’s the short-track speed skating. He’s coming last—there’s five people—but he has made it to the final. That’s what I said. That’s his effort. He got himself into the final. And one of the Chinese guys trips the US guy, and the first four people—on the last lap—they are coming around the last bend.

CB: Oh, right, I remember this.

KS: They’re all staggered. And Steve Bradbury—so far behind them all—keeps his feet and gets over the line first, and he gets the gold medal. And the person who gets the silver and the bronze—they actually crossed the finish line on their ass, because they haven’t got up from falling over. So that’s a great example of this idea of, yes, he got lucky, but he did the hard work to get there.

AC: Well, and he didn’t wait at home and wait for the gold medal to be delivered to his door.

KS: He did not, absolutely. He went to training everyday for probably four years, like everyone else did, and he just sloughed it away. So, yeah, that’s a good example of what you were saying, Austin, I think, where you’ve gotta do the work. You’ve gotta be in it to win it, basically. That’s true, people sometimes think that with a Jupiter transit. “But it didn’t happen.” “But what did you do about it?”

CB: Well, and it’s that, and also it’s like ‘goods’ are experienced in a way that’s more subtle than bad things.

KS: That’s very true.

CB: That’s one of the really tough things astrologically, especially when talking with clients. That was always one of my biggest frustrations talking with clients—that people readily recognize challenges and hardships and difficulties in their life because they’re very easy to identify and to just see. But positive things people often take for granted, or they don’t stand out as much in our minds. And so, sometimes in that way Jupiter transits can be much more subtle than people are expecting. Or sometimes like it comes and it happens and something positive happens, but it’s not like—you know, it’s not like the most overtly positive, just amazing, transformative thing possible, and so people just kind of shrug and they’re like, “Oh, okay, I guess that’s good.”

AC: Yeah. Well, yeah, and just kind of circling back to the original point, you don’t need to participate at all in having something terrible happen to you, right? Like you can just be in a car accident and that’s enough. You don’t need to like work on that. Whereas to experience success, you had to have—you had to have picked something and put effort towards it. You know, Saturn doesn’t need your help, right? Mars—Mars doesn’t need your help to enact its significations. Whereas with Jupiter, you know, you kinda have to participate, unless we’re looking at the extremely rare lotto win. But even then you have to buy the ticket. You know, it’s not like somebody—let’s say somebody has Jupiter in the 2nd for a year. You know, it’s transiting the 2nd for a year. It’s not that—like that will probably be a better year for money, but it doesn’t mean that people will drop off bags of money in front of your door regularly.

KS: No.

AC: It means that your efforts will meet with greater success than whatever your baseline level is.

CB: Right.

KS: Yeah. You can get a bigger bonus this year than you might normally, but you may equally be working harder for it.

CB: Or one of the things that’s funny is I was talking to somebody recently—they had like a Jupiter transit, and it was really positive in their natal chart, but it was in their 5th house. And both of their children had really good fortunate things happen at that time, and the person was like, “Oh, okay. It’s something good in my chart—that’s showing up in my chart—but it’s actually happening in their life, and it’s not that positive for me.” Or I’ve seen people do that with like 7th house transits and something really positive happens to their partner.

KS: I’ve seen that so often—Jupiter in the 5th—that I start including it now in my standard interpretation. Jupiter in the 5th—something good can happen to you around 5th house stuff, or one of your children is gonna get an amazing opportunity. And the other area or the other house that I’ve seen it show up a lot—and I now include it in my interpretation—Jupiter in the 8th house. Your partner gets a financial windfall or bonus of some kind, basically. So you don’t get the benefit, but your partner’s rolling in it for whatever reason. Which, I mean, should be of benefit, I guess, too.

AC: You know, that’s really funny because—so I have Jupiter in my 5th this year—Scorpio is my 5th—and I don’t have any children, but I actually didn’t connect this until just now. A good friend of mine has four children—the fourth just arrived in December.—and I’ve been like really into his kids. I’m like, “Oh, how are they doing?” dah-dah-dah, blah-blah-blah, you know, “That three-year-old is just so adorable,” to the point that I’m annoying Kait.

KS: Right.

AC: And I hadn’t connected that, “Oh, Jupiter’s in your 5th house, dummy.”

KS: Yeah.

AC: “Of course you’re extra ‘Jupiterian’ around kids.”

CB: Right. That’s one of the really difficult things in terms of researching astrology, though. The person, it may be happening—the chart may be showing something that’s happening like tangentially in somebody else’s life that they’re connected with. And, you know, if you’re researching that, is the native aware of that? Or are they gonna report it accurately in terms of what happened in that time? Or if you say something positive happened in the sphere of children, or in the sphere of relationships, during this timeframe, and they report saying, “No, I don’t recall anything happening objectively in my life at that time,” but it was actually happening like in the life of their partner or their children or something, it’s a frustrating—it can be a frustrating issue or a challenge in terms of researching astrology.

AC: Yeah. Well, and it’s—it reemphasizes what astrology is actually designed to show you, which is the life. It’s your life. It’s not just you. You know, to a certain degree you are one of the 12 houses and then there’s the rest of your life, right? You know, I think people—probably partially because of the culture, and partially because of certain styles of astrology—want everything to be happening to them rather than to be happening within the container of their life. And there’s a difference between identifying with just ‘me’ part of my life versus ‘this is my life as a whole’, right? Does that make sense?

KS: Totally, totally. Yeah, and then it can be happening that you’re experiencing it as a secondary. Like you said, Austin, you and Kait—it’s not like you’re having a child this year, or you’re looking after your own children, but Jupiter in the 5th house, there are more young children in your life in general. And you’re more—you’re learning—yeah, with Jupiter, you learn. You’re learning about the routines of young kids and how they work and all of that stuff.

AC: Yeah. And I’m more interested in being a benefic towards them—

KS: Yes.

AC: —where I can be like, “Yeah, those are my friend’s kids. That’s fine. Let’s go hang out.”

KS: No, no, no—you want to take the kids out. You want to buy the kids treats. You’re like, “Oh, my God, this kid would like this toy,” or whatever.

AC: Well, let’s not go crazy.

KS: Okay.

AC: I’ll play video games with them.

KS: There you go. That’s a good thing.

AC: Make sure no one dies while mom and dad run to the store.

KS: Correct, yeah. And honestly, it’s funny. I’m learning about children a lot cuz my brother’s now got two kids, and my sister’s got one on the way. One of my sisters has got one on the way. And honestly, when you’ve got a couple—like my brother and his partner—just being there and saying, “I’ll play with these kids, you don’t have to worry about them for a couple of hours,” is like the best gift of all. Anyway, this could be the ‘Jupiter transits’ podcast, Chris.

CB: Yeah, I know. It’s basically turning into that. That, and ‘the other stuff happening in other people’s lives and showing up in your chart’ podcast.

KS: I mean, this month—to bring it back to our stated topic—this is a Jupiter station month. So whatever Jupiter in Scorpio is doing for all of us, we’re getting a bit of punctuation or an emphasis around that this month.

CB: Yeah.

AC: Yeah. And as I just experienced, maybe the station will serve to point out what Jupiter has been doing since October.

CB: Definitely.

AC: I just described a pattern that has been consistent over those months I hadn’t connected to Jupiter’s time in Scorpio.

CB: Yeah.

AC: I was just like, “Oh, 5th house. I’m gonna be really creative and stuff.”

CB: Yeah, that’s really important, especially for these outer planets. The stations act as an intensification and like an exclamation mark behind whatever that transit is about, especially for individuals. And so, it’s something that perhaps has been building up already or happening at least in the background ever since Jupiter ingressed into Scorpio months ago. But for many people—especially if you have natal placements close to that degree or those degrees—this station, because of the effect of it having a sort of intensification by sitting on the same degree for so long, oftentimes will bring those themes more to the forefront and will make them more clear at that time. And we’ll get two of those stations. So we’ll get one station at 23 Scorpio, where Jupiter stations retrograde here in March, and then we’ll get a retrograde station, which will happen—when does that happen? Or, no, it stations direct.

KS: It’s July. It stations July at 13 Scorpio.

CB: 13 Scorpio. And then eventually—to sort of close up the point that I made earlier—Jupiter will eventually return back to 23 Scorpio for the final time in October.

KS: Yes.

CB: And so, that’s the notion of it returning back to ground that it’s already walked on. And so, sometimes you may see a connection between some events that happen here in March around the time of the retrograde station at 23 Scorpio and then Jupiter returning back to that degree for the final time in October. So, yeah, pay attention to what happens. All right, so that brings us back to this month and back to what happens after the Jupiter station in Scorpio, which takes place around March 8-March 9. It looks like the next major thing is actually the next lunation, which is a New Moon in Pisces, right?

KS: What’s the date of that? Yeah, that’s around the time, I think—get the right Google doc. Pisces New Moon. Yeah, and the Mars ingress. Cuz those two things are big, but they are happening on the same day.

AC: Yeah. In short, things really start changing quite quickly once we get into the second-half of the month.

CB: Yeah. So this is second-half of the month, and it basically gets started. I mean, this really—the New Moon does act as the dividing point, I think, in the month. So the New Moon takes place at 27° of Pisces on March 17. And at the time of the New Moon, Mars is like literally at the very last degree and minute of Sagittarius. It’s at 29°59’ Sagittarius. And then just a little bit later, like within an hour or two of the New Moon, Mars makes its ingress into Capricorn.

AC: And the Moon—the very New Moon squares Mars in Capricorn only a few hours after that New Moon. So we get introduced to Mars in Capricorn immediately. And it’s the Moon—it’s the Moon just a few hours after the New Moon in late Pisces ingressing into Aries, into Mars-ruled Aries, and then making a square with Mars just barely into Capricorn. And of course the square is Mars’ aspect. So we’re introduced to that actor quite thoroughly, quite early.

KS: Yes. So we could expect maybe—as much as it is a Pisces New Moon, even I have to kind of get into the ‘warrior’ camp here with the Mars—the Moon-Mars square. There’s some frustration, or there’s some tension, or there’s an irritation or an annoyance. And I think this is kinda gonna draw our attention to what we need to do over the next two months with Mars in Capricorn. Cuz Mars will be slowing down for its own retrograde by the time it gets to the end of its journey through Capricorn. But the other thing that Mars in Capricorn serves to do is tie into the longer trend of Saturn in Capricorn. And so, there is—I don’t know if ‘heavy’ is the right word, but there is this sense of needing to knuckle down or to get on with things or to do reorganizing of expectations and deadlines and boundaries, so that things are more realistic, because we’ve gotta get on with what we’ve gotta do, and we’ve gotta stay on target.

AC: Yeah, I think that’s right. And if we take a second to contrast Mars in Sagittarius and Mars in Capricorn, as we discussed last month, Mars in Sagittarius is Mars in a Jupiter-ruled sign. It has a lot to do with enthusiasm and reason and meaning for action. Whereas Capricorn is an earth sign, and it’s the earth sign where Mars is most comfortable—it’s exalted there. And so, with Capricorn, it’s more like, “Well, I don’t care how you feel about it, or whether you’re enthusiastic or not. These things need to get done. Are you gonna take care of these problems or not?” You know, it doesn’t matter, especially with Saturn, right? Saturn’s like, “I don’t care if you’re excited about it. I don’t care if it’s meaningful. It needs to get done.”

KS: Yes.

CB: Right.

KS: So it’s that idea of the contrast, Austin, I guess, around the responsibilities and the due diligence and that you’ve made this commitment. And it doesn’t matter if you’ve now changed your mind, you’ve either gotta honor that commitment, or you’ve gotta have a hard conversation about whether you are going to do that.

AC: Yeah, that’s a good way to put it in terms of what you’ve bound yourself to, what commitments you’ve made, and also, what requirements your life has, right? Like everybody’s going to have to pay taxes—or everyone in America is supposed to pay taxes while Mars is in Capricorn this year.

KS: Yes, yes.

CB: Right. That idea of like rules and laws seems to be like a really frequent theme with Capricorn.

AC: Yeah. Saturn. There’s been a lot of—one thing that was interesting to watch since we did our ‘Saturn in Capricorn’ discussion was how many people have been convicted of various things. Like the ‘law and order and being on the wrong side of the law’ theme that we saw historically and anticipated this time definitely, definitely already in effect. I guess one of the—one of the big themes for the second-half of March, to sort of put a tent over it, is the contrast between Mars-Saturn-Pluto in Capricorn—in earthy, matter-of-fact Capricorn—and the Mercury-Venus, and very soon, the Sun in Mars-ruled Aries, because Aries is Mars-ruled, but it has a very different quality than Capricorn.

CB: Right.

AC: Kelly, how do you see the contrast between Capricorn and Aries? And how do you—how would you approach trying to navigate that?

KS: Yeah, I think it’s a really good distinction to make, Austin. And I think, you know, when we think about Mars being in rulership in Aries versus being exalted in Capricorn, we do get a more productive version of Mars in Capricorn. And I think the Capricorn versus—you know, I think on the cardinal side, Aries is just so reactive. It’s what I call ‘reactive/responsive’. It’s doing before it’s thought or planned or considered the consequences thereof, whereas Capricorn is almost the complete opposite. There is no acting and no doing until we have fully assessed and done this due diligence kind of report on the long-term consequences or impact. So I do think it’s an interesting tug, if you like. And being a square aspect, there is that friction between what you want to do now—or that immediate urge that you want to satisfy—versus that desire to stay focused on something that has a longer timeframe or needs more of that consistent measured output. And that, I think, is gonna be something that we’re all dealing with to a certain extent in this second-half of March and heading into April, because that Aries sort of—Aries/Capricorn face-off, if you like, is really dominant for that Aries season or Aries month.

AC: Yeah, it persists well into April.

KS: Yeah.

AC: I think there’s, how shall we say, an acute danger of recognizing all of the things that need to be done—“Oh, I should have done this earlier,” all this Mars-Saturn in Capricorn stuff—and then going into full Aries ‘adrenalization’ mode to try to get it all done. But that’s not the ‘Saturn’ pace. And so, that means burnout, cuz we’ve basically got a month of this Capricorn/Aries tension, and you can’t—you can’t keep it at 11 for a full month. And so, like I think you were alluding to, pacing is gonna be a real challenge here. You know, this is—this is not—this might feel at certain moments like, I don’t know, like a fire drill or like a sprint. But this is actually going—this is much more of a marathon, or at least a 10K.

KS: You know what it feels like? I used to run track or do athletics in high school. It feels like the damn 400-meter sprint. Which, if you’ve ever done sprinting, 400 meters is hard. You know, a hundred meters, 200 meters, you just go full-tilt. But 400 meters—you’re at the edge of your ability to go full-tilt. And this is why it’s such a specialized race, because the distance—you’re really at your lactic acid level there. So it feels like, yeah, how do we maintain a pace that we can sustain for a longer period, knowing that we can’t just do the hundred-meter dash down the street here? And I think, Austin, you summarized it perfectly when you said this is a marathon, not a sprint. And I think one of the problems with the late March and then into April period—if you try and approach it like a sprint, you will burn yourself out. You will be exhausted. You know, by the time we get to the Aries Full Moon—which we must put the chart of that up before we finish today, because that Aries Full Moon basically ties into the Mars-Saturn conjunction. Like there’s a big sort of T-square pattern that comes in. And that happens over the very last weekend in March, which is also the Easter weekend. And I just think, you know, you’re gonna get a reality check probably around pacing—I know even for me, I’m thinking about my schedule at that point in time, and I’m gonna be working on a big project that I’ve gotta stick with consistently—and to rein yourself in so that you don’t burn out I think is key.

AC: Yeah, I think—I like your ‘400-meter’ analogy better than the marathon or 10K, cuz I think that’s right. I think that there will—like the proper pace will not be a jog—

KS: No.

AC: —but it also won’t be full-tilt the whole time.

KS: No. But it’s like it’s just off full-tilt, isn’t it?

AC: Yeah.

KS: But you’ve gotta be able to sustain it, that’s the key. And if you’ve ever run track, 400 meters, you’re just so exhausted to try and find that sweet spot between running fast enough to stay in the race without peaking too soon.

AC: Love it.

KS: So, anyway.

AC: Perfect.

CB: Definitely.

AC: There’s been no wars or baking yet, but we’re on the track.

CB: So, as you said, Kelly, so jumping forward, that lunation is one of the last big things that happens, but there are a couple of things between them.

KS: Yeah.

CB: So the first is the Sun of course makes its annual ingress into Aries on March 20. So the Sun catches up with Mercury and Venus and Uranus, which are already in that sign. And then shortly after that Mercury stations retrograde at 16° of Aries by about March 22-March 23. So, basically, Mercury retrograde for the next little while, for the next couple of weeks. Or that’s the start of the Mercury retrograde towards the end of March here. And then, yeah, pretty much that lunation. Venus eventually departs from Aries and ingresses into Taurus about March—around March 30-March 31. And then at that point, on March 31, we also get the Full Moon at 10° of Libra. Which is that lunation that you were just talking about, Kelly, which ends up creating a T-square with Mars and Saturn, which are at about 7°-8° of Capricorn at that time, squaring the Sun and Moon, which complete their opposition at 10° of Libra and Aries.

KS: Yeah. I mean, I think it’s always interesting when we do get a Full Moon nearer to a solstice or an equinox anyway. And then there is—you know, I was looking at this, and I’m like, “Oh, Libra Full Moon,” and I’m getting all excited; it’s ruled by Venus in Taurus. Then I looked at the chart a little bit more, and I was like, “Ah, shit.”

CB: Right.

KS: You know, the ‘Mars-Saturn’ story, to be a little bit crude to our listeners. But I was like that Mars-Saturn interference, “Foul play there at the free-shot line,” or something. There’s aggravation. It’s a Full Moon anyway, and now it’s a Full Moon square—you know, we’ve got the Sun conjunct retrograde Mercury, and they’re square to Mars and Saturn. So there’s frustration. This is you run into the brick wall, basically, I think. I’m interested to hear what you guys think about this, too, though.

CB: Yeah, ‘brick wall’ is a good metaphor. Cuz at this point, Mars is still applying, and now it’s almost about a degree away from hitting that complete conjunction with Saturn. Which really, when you think about Mars and the kind of boundless energy and enthusiasm associated with that archetype, and you think of it applying and moving towards and then running into Saturn—that idea of running a wall or a really hard boundary or barrier is a really good analogy.

AC: Yeah. And Mars—when Mars and Saturn are conjoined, they often indicate difficulties for individuals and collectives. Sometimes it’s just being—having a lot to do with being very tired, but, it’s also worth considering what house that conjunction and co-presence is occurring in in your chart. I was actually having a discussion yesterday with my top tier Patreon people, and we were talking about this, and I had two, I think, worthwhile things to say about working with that or preparing for that period of co-presence, and certainly the conjunction—the exact conjunction itself most of all. And one is the proactive art of if you’re going to—if the story that wants to be told during this period is a ‘Mar-Saturn in Capricorn’ story, pick your ordeal in which you’re going to experience that rather than waiting for the ordeal to come to you, right? You know, instead of trying to take it easy and having a rotten time, pick something hard that’s worth doing.

KS: Yes.

AC: So that’s the volitional side. And then the other side of it is we know that Mars-Saturn conjunctions often pop out unpleasant events. And so, you know, on a very simple level, look at that house, and during the ‘Jupiterian’ half of March, consider how you might safeguard that area of your life, or be prepared to deal with a little something. If that is your 6th house, which is the house of—the primary house of health concerns—well, maybe come into that in better shape and taking care of yourself, so that if your health is challenged, you’re in a place to—you’re in a place to absorb that. Or if it’s your 2nd house, which is money, maybe don’t go into that period having blown all your money on an expensive purchase. Come in with a little—as much padding as you can muster, etc., etc. So, you know, that’s not a ‘freak out and stare at those days waiting for doom to arrive’, but it’s just like be sensible, right? If you know that there’s a greater likelihood that there will be difficulties in this area, don’t leave that area unattended and vulnerable. And also, do you best to pick your trial rather than have your trial pick you.

KS: Which is actually—sorry, go, Chris.

CB: I just like that statement ‘freak out and wait for that’. That’s like a good motto or title for an astrology book or something.

AC: Well, and it’s something that I think we all worked through at various points in time and that I think is inevitable, too. It’s an inevitable part of learning how to incorporate astrology into your life. Once you get a sense of when good things might happen and bad things might happen to you, there’s a tendency to stare at those dates and wait for it to land on you.

CB: Right.

AC: You know, if you’re going to use astrology, you need to be able to put it in context and incorporate it without—without it creating a giant stress ball, cuz that stress ball in and of itself is not going to help you.

CB: Yeah. I mean, that’s something I still struggle with. And I actually have a question of that I’m not entirely sure that that’s something that any astrologer ever fully gets over or gets around—and on some level the practice almost naturally lends itself to—and so it’s more of like an ongoing process that all astrologers work through and have to wrestle with on some level. I mean, do you feel like you ever fully transcend that completely, Austin, like if you’re talking really honestly?

AC: Well, okay, so I’m certainly worried by far, far, far less than when I first realized astrology was real.

CB: Sure.

AC: That’s a panic moment, right? But I would agree there’s an ongoing process—almost like hygiene or digestion—with the astrology that you can look at, like seeing that two-year period is not going to be the high point of my life. In fact, that might be the hardest of this decade, right? This is actually very much the method of the Stoics, which is to work through it ahead of time. Say, okay, if this is going to happen—if this happens, instead of just being like, “Oh, my God, it can’t happen, it’s way too awful,” instead put yourself there and get used to it, right? There’s a—some Buddhist schools advise people to contemplate the various ways that the body can die ahead of time. Because it’s gonna die. The body’s gonna die. And so, getting acquainted with the fact that these might happen to you takes it out of that panicked and immediate response. It doesn’t mean you have to love it. But there’s a level of acceptance—there’s a level of working through things ahead of time which allows you to be more calm and centered in the moment. And this is also—this was part of Napoleon’s military genius. He did not plan—he did not expect everything to go as planned, but he would sit there in his tent at night, and he would work through all of the problems that could happen, what if the cavalry doesn’t swing around in time, what if the cannons are jammed, and he’d think, “Okay, well, what am I gonna do at that point?” So when he came to those inevitable moments of chaos, he’d already thought through and was like, “Okay, I have these options at this point,” rather than being emotionally attached to things going perfectly. And so, you know, our lives are less chaotic than those of a 19th century general, but we can still apply that. You know, if you’re afraid of something, sit with it for a while. There are of course situations that are terrible, but most of what we’re afraid of is actually not that bad when it happens. It doesn’t end the world, right? Cuz we have an emotional response, which is, “Oh, my God, that can’t possibly happen. That’ll shatter everything.” But these things happen, and they don’t, and you have to sit with things a little bit in order to get through the panic.

CB: Right. Yeah, and I understand that that’s the—that was actually the original purpose for astrology. It’s one of the things I noted in my book, that literally the only philosophical statement that all the astrologers agreed on—at least in the Greco-Roman period—was this very Stoic idea that the purpose of astrology is to get used to the things that you have to accept about the future, so that you can come to terms with them and not be extremely depressed when they happen, or extremely overjoyed when they happen or what have you. But you develop a certain amount of balance and sort of equilibrium that you can approach all events in your life with. That being said, that’s like the ideal if you’re like an enlightened, Stoic sage. But like in reality, in a practical working sense, one of the—I don’t want to say pitfall, cuz I don’t want to frame it too negatively—things about astrology and working with it—especially as we do, in more predictive forms of astrology—is that the astrologer, there’s always still a certain amount of uncertainty about precisely how a specific and a certain amount of wiggle room for how a specific transit or time-lord period or whatever is gonna manifest itself in terms of the specifics. And as the astrologer, one of the tricky things is that you’ve seen already, and you know the full spectrum of worst-case scenario and best-case scenario, and you don’t always exactly know precisely where it’s gonna fall on that spectrum. And that uncertainty in and of itself can sometimes be troubling, and I’ve seen that and almost sat and thought about it and meditated on that uncertainty and the things that it raises in one’s mind as you’re thinking about it in anticipation, and the extent to which that’s helpful or not helpful, or how astrologers sort of deal with that.

AC: Yeah. Yeah, I think that’s absolutely right. And think that sitting with it if you find yourself—if you find yourself dwelling upon and worrying about a transit, or needing it to be amazing, set your timer on your phone for 10 minutes, sit down, and then only let yourself think about that for that 10 minutes and sort of un-knot that and take it apart. And think about, you know, the best versus worst case for that transit and work on just being ready for that small fan of possibilities. And that’s part of why I brought up the ‘Napoleon’ example, because he wasn’t trying to predict the one thing that could happen. He was looking at the fan of possibilities and putting himself in all of those places and getting comfortable ahead of time in all of those places. And so, Kelly, I wanted to ask you—because I feel like I sort have had to develop this because of writing sometimes a whole year ahead of time and getting freaked out about something that’s gonna happen in nine months, or getting excited about something that’s gonna happen in five months. And I feel like spending that much time writing ahead kinda makes you do that, because you’ve already—you can’t un-see it, right? How do you deal with this?

KS: Totally. I mean, I think I—look, so many thoughts. You definitely get that insight. You know, I think for us, Austin, we write a lot about it. I mean, I’m just about to start writing the 2019 horoscope. So I’m kind of like in my mind a part of me is almost like I’m done with 2018. Not that I’m done with it. I’ve gotta live through many of the days left, but I’m already starting to explore the landscape—the celestial landscape for next year. And I think that exploration—which is what every astrologer does, however you output that insight—is that you get a sense of, oh, there’s a bit of a cautionary period here, or this period looks a little bit more uplifting. And I think maybe it’s just embracing or touching that slightly Stoic perspective that every year has some cautionary periods and every year has some high point periods, and knowing when they are is great. I mean, you can’t always anticipate what you’re gonna do. I know, for me, what’s happened with my horoscope-writing project, the deadline is a month earlier than normal, which basically means that the hard, heavy writing is just gonna happen over this Mars-Saturn conjunction, in the two weeks either side. Now I knew that the Mars-Saturn period was coming, and I’m like, you know, there’s gonna be some hard work, there’s gonna be giving up some short-term things, Mars stuff, so that I can do the long-term things, Saturn stuff. But I couldn’t have said exactly the circumstances because I only found out about that deadline, which was changed by a production department in a magazine that I have nothing to do with. And I found out about that a few weeks ago in my yearly check-in call, and they’re like, “Oh, by the way, the deadline is the middle of April, not the middle of May.” And I was like, “Good times, good times.”

AC: Thanks.

CB: Right.

KS: Thanks. But I make the adjustments. As you said, Austin—I think what you were alluding to with Napoleon is he’s got contingency plans. He’s thought about ‘A’, ‘B’, and ‘C’ options, or worst-case scenarios. “What if this thing goes wrong? How will I handle it? What if this thing goes wrong?” And ultimately it’s like you’ve gotta stay your eyes on the final prize. Like, for me, it’s to get the magazine delivered on time. What do I have to change and restructure in the timeframe leading up to that to make that happen? And there are certain things that I might have wanted to do personally, like go away with my husband for my anniversary. That’s not happening until after the deadline, and that’s just the realistic choices. And I think a Mars-Saturn aspect like this—don’t be afraid of making some of those tough choices. Like be practical. Be honest with yourself. This is how much time or energy you’ve got. Realistically, can you do all of those things, or can you do one or two things to a really high standard? And I think that’s also one way we can approach this, with a view to being productive in mind.

CB: Definitely. I love that, and that’s a really good point. I mean, things are rarely like the worst-case scenario. In fact, it’s often just much more moderate, like mild annoyance that you need to get through; like, in your case, with having that deadline moved up a month, and therefore, having to put other things aside that you’d rather be doing and just work through it. And it’s gonna be hard, and it’s gonna take a lot of energy and effort, but it’s like you’ll get through to the other side eventually.

KS: Totally. And that’s a mindset, though, and every person—based on the natural themes in your chart—is either open to doing the hard work and making the changes, or resistant to start with. Because some people’s personalities, with certain placements or chart configurations are like, “No, I don’t wanna do it in this timeframe.” You know, you can dig your heels in, and then two weeks of that timeframe is gone, and you’ve still gotta make up whatever you’ve gotta make up.

AC: Totally.

KS: Yeah.

CB: Sure. All right, well, I think this is actually bringing us to the end of this episode, as I think we’ve run out of days of March and astrological alignments to talk about. Are there any major ones that we’re totally overlooking or that we forgot to mention for the later part of March?

AC: I don’t believe so. I have one more thing to say just about that Full Moon in Libra.

CB: Mm-hmm.

AC: So the Full Moon in Libra highlights the Mars and Saturn, but it also highlights Venus’ ingress into Taurus, where Venus is very strong, because the Libra Moon is ruled by that Venus. And so, to jump back to Kelly’s 400-meter dash, I think maybe this is two 400-meters and that the moment to pause and reassess and maybe catch your breath is the Full Moon, right? Cuz the Full Moon—the Sun and the Moon, the left and the right eyes, are staring right at Mars and Saturn, right? So it’s not that the race is over, but there is this Venusian ingress, and that is the ruler of the Moon.

KS: We can’t forget that, because that is the best thing at the end of March.

AC: And it’s not—cuz it’s not ‘this begins a period of leisure’, it’s the ‘you might need to make yourself do a little bit of leisure in order to complete the second leg of the race’, right?

KS: Yeah. This is the track. You’re at the track meet, you’ve done your heats, so your 800-meter—400-meter dash, your 400-meter race—and now you’re gonna back up for the final cuz you made it through. The turnaround to the final is maybe not as long as you would, but you’ve still got a bit of time to re-hydrate or get a massage in between.

AC: Exactly, exactly.

KS: I’ve loved that metaphor to death.

CB: And the ingress is also just a glimmer of hope at the end of the tunnel, because like the Mars-Saturn conjunction is so close to being complete at that point, and it eventually does complete in early April. And then not too long after that Venus will then catch up to those same degrees from Taurus and sort of trine Saturn in Capricorn and then trine Mars in Capricorn, as those two planets are separating from that conjunction. And so, there’s this sense of like easing things down or the tension’s starting to dissipate to some extent after that point.

AC: Exactly.

CB: All right, good times. Well, I think then that that’s it for March. So that has been our monthly forecast for March. And we will have to check in again in a month to, I guess then, talk about April.

AC: Yeah.

KS: And you know what? I’m sure when we actually record this, the ‘Mars-Saturn’ thing will probably be building.

CB: Oh, right.

KS: Our next record will be at that time.

CB: All right.

AC: Yeah, it’ll have to be.

KS: Yeah.

CB: So everything we just said will all be like culminating at that time for the next recording. Well, good. I mean, then we’ll hopefully have something to talk about for another two hours, like this episode has been.

AC: Yeah, definitely.

KS: I don’t think we’re in any danger of running out of things to talk about.

CB: Right.

AC: So, Kelly, do you have anything coming up this month? Are you doing anything?

KS: You know what? I don’t have any special events—oh, I’m going to NORWAC. I’m doing the NORWAC conference. I’m not doing any other teaching this month.

CB: That’s in March.

KS: Yeah. The NORWAC conference is two months early this year to accommodate UAC. So it will be the weekend basically, the 23rd to the 25th of March in Seattle. So if anyone is going to be in the neighborhood, come on down.

CB: Awesome. And, Austin?

KS: What about you, Austin?

CB: You got any classes or anything?

AC: Yeah, I have two webinars that I’m doing this month. One of them is on Saturn in Capricorn, and I believe I titled it, “The Grimoire of the Grumpy Goat: Magical Approaches to Saturn in Capricorn.” And so, that’s going to be a combination of remedial approaches to Saturn in Capricorn, as well as active magical approaches. We’ll be looking at some recipes from the Picatrix, and we’ll also be looking at certain planetary remediation strategies from Jyotish for actively working with Saturn in Capricorn. And then I’m also doing a webinar on the astrology of generations. And this is something that I know all three of us are interested in and aware of. You know, I just keep seeing these kinds of terrible articles about Millennials and GenXers and all of that, and astrology has—if we use the outer planets, particularly, Pluto—we have a very elegant system for looking at generations and generational qualities. And so, I’ve been meaning to write it up for literally four years, and I figured I’d just have a webinar and talk about it and explain it. Like here’s astrology’s take on that, it’s pretty—it’s pretty elegant. And it fits—it actually fits things better than a lot of the discussions that I hear online. And then, not this month, but beginning in April, I’m beginning another eight-month round of the fundamentals of astrology. So that’s my ‘0 to 60’ class. 0 to 60 in eight months. The acceleration is not intense, but that’s because it’s a process. You know, you don’t learn astrology in one cool webinar.

KS: No.

AC: You don’t obtain proficiency. You can learn about astrology in a cool webinar, but to become proficient it takes a while. So I’ll be gearing up for that to begin in April. And enrollment is open.

CB: Brilliant. And people can find out more information about that on your website, which is austincoppock.com, right?

AC: Yep.

KS: I forgot one thing. I’m doing a free talk at the AYA on Wednesday night about how to set up your business as an astrologer.

CB: Oh, that’s awesome. That would be—

AC: Very nice.

CB: —a great talk. And is that a free talk, or a donation?

KS: It’s free, yeah, through their ‘Wednesday night drinks’ thing. So just find the AYA on Facebook, basically.

CB: Right. Or their website is like youngastrologers.org, I believe.

AC: I believe so.

KS: Cuz you guys would be able to tell us.

CB: All right, so, yeah.

AC: We should know, right?

KS: I was just thinking—

CB: Right.

KS: —you guys should know.

CB: Just do a Google search for ‘the Association for Young Astrologers’ and you’ll find their website. And there you’ll find the link to Kelly’s free webinar on that, which would be great for everyone to attend if you have even a passing interest in pursuing astrology professionally or doing consultations at some point.

KS: Yeah, we’re gonna talk about how to set rates for consults, if you’re doing writing gigs, how to price it. You know, so just a few ideas about the business side of it, which is so critical to getting started. So, yeah.

CB: Definitely. And, as for me, the only thing I have is I’ll be back to doing the podcast next month. And I recently released—I meant to mention—a webinar that I just did that’s two-and-a-half-hours-long on zodiacal releasing from the Lot of Eros, and how to use that technique in order to divide up your entire life into chapters and paragraphs with respect to relationships. And specifically, to identify different periods that are auspicious for relationships and in which relationships are more likely to happen, including major transitions in your love life. So it’s a pretty good technique. And I’m glad that I finally got a chance to do an up-to-date webinar on it, cuz it’s been one of my main timing techniques that I’ve developed over the past decade.

AC: Nice.

KS: Excellent. I caught a little bit of that live, and I’m looking forward to the recording. So thank you for your hard work.

CB: Awesome, cool. And I’ll put a link to that in the description page on The Astrology Podcast website. And, otherwise, yeah, thanks everyone for listening. Thanks to our live audience of patrons who attended. I appreciate it. And you got to see some of the behind-the-scenes stuff as we dealt with technical issues, which I’m sure was fun. So, yeah. As always, if you enjoy the podcast, and you’re listening to it on iTunes, please go to iTunes and give us a good rating, since it’ll help other people to find it. If you’re interested in supporting the podcast, then please consider becoming a patron on our page on Patreon. And, otherwise, yeah, we’ll see you again next month. So thanks everyone for listening, and we’ll see you next time.

AC: Bye.

KS: Bye.