The Astrology Podcast
Transcript of Episode 525, titled:
Saturn-Neptune Conjunctions in Birth Charts
With Chris Brennan
Episode originally released on February 20, 2026
Original episode URL:
https://theastrologypodcast.com/2026/02/20/saturn-neptune-conjunctions-in-birth-charts/
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Note: This is a transcript of a spoken word podcast. If possible, we encourage you to listen to the audio or video version, since they include inflections that may not translate well when written out. Our transcripts are created by human transcribers, and the text may contain errors and differences from the spoken audio. If you find any errors then please send them to us by email: theastrologypodcast@gmail.com
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Transcribed by Teresa “Peri” Lardo
Transcription released March 3rd, 2026
Copyright © 2026 TheAstrologyPodcast.com
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CHRIS BRENNAN: Hey. My name is Chris Brennan, and you’re listening to The Astrology Podcast. In this episode, I’m gonna look at Saturn-Neptune conjunctions in birth charts and share some preliminary research I’ve been doing recently about how that shows up in the lives of different individuals, especially focusing in this case on celebrities and notable individuals who have documented lives.
All right, so today I’m recording this on February 16th, 2026, and the Saturn-Neptune conjunction is finally going exact just days from now on February 20th. And over the course of the past few years, we’ve been talking about this conjunction a lot in a mundane sense in terms of like, what it will indicate in terms of world events. And a year ago, my friend Nick Dagan Best and I, we did a whole episode looking at Saturn-Neptune conjunctions in history and what kind of historical events those conjunctions coincided with over the course of the past 2,000 years or so. But in this episode, I wanted to talk more about how it shows up in a natal context in birth charts in terms of people’s lives and especially in terms of concrete events.
So this isn’t comprehensive. I don’t feel like I’ve finished researching this topic. But I do have a pretty long list of some examples that I wanted to go through today just to share some of the research that I’ve been doing to give people a little insight into this conjunction when it comes to acting as a natal signature, in some instances also including what house it falls in, which seems to be really important in terms of showing the specific area of manifestation.
So this is not the last time I’ll do this topic, but I’ll probably do other follow-up episodes in the future. But instead of getting caught up in too much preliminary stuff, why don’t we just jump into it and start looking at some charts? So I will show some charts on the screen for those watching the video versions occasionally, but for the most part I think I’m gonna just like, talk through some of these examples for the purpose of this episode.
All right! So the first one I wanted to start with is the birth chart of Betty Ford, who is the former First Lady of the United States. She was married to President Gerald Ford in the 1970s. And she has a pretty close Saturn-Neptune conjunction in Leo in the 12th house. We actually have a timed chart for her; she had Virgo rising. And this conjunction was taking place in the 12th house. And the story with her is that, to make a long story short, that she was dealing with some issues, some health issues and different things, in the ‘60s and ‘70s, and she started developing a dependency on medication basically and on painkillers. And some of this was triggered by having a pinched nerve and severe back pain, and she was prescribed opioid painkillers. So that’s where the 12th house thing is showing up where it’s like, there was a physical or a chronic ailment that was, you know, really painful for her, and as a result of that they started prescribing her opioids. But then also during the same period, she started relying on alcohol as a way to cope with some of the things involving her husband’s really demanding political career.
So following a family intervention in 1978, she actually ended up channeling this in a positive way where in 1982, she cofounded the Betty Ford Center, which was this pioneering nonprofit residential treatment facility in California dedicated to helping individuals with especially addiction issues and to overcome addiction issues.
So this is a really beautiful example, because of the conciseness and because we can see on the one hand the issue that came up with the Saturn-Neptune conjunction where developing a addiction basically to painkillers, but then also eventually channeling that in a positive direction in order to try to help other people who were suffering from similar addiction issues.
So pretty straightforward example. And then like, the Betty Ford Center is just like, this legendary treatment center at this point in time where people can go to receive treatment for things, especially like, celebrities over the past few decades commonly are mentioned as having gone there to deal with different addiction issues.
So that’s a good example of sometimes with Saturn-Neptune, we see substance abuse issues can come up, and sometimes that can be in a challenging way, but sometimes it can be in a way of like, overcoming those issues and eventually trying to help other people that suffer from similar issues.
All right, so that was one example I was looking at recently. Moving on. Other examples – another one that’s more tricky is we’ve seen recently how sometimes Saturn-Neptune conjunctions can deal with mysteries and mysterious things happening that are either being suppressed or where there’s mysteries that are being disclosed and like, uncovered and solved. And that’s obviously been a major theme with this Saturn-Neptune conjunction over the past year with some of the Epstein files and things like that. But interestingly, I found another birth chart that brings in some of these themes, and it’s the birth chart of JonBenet Ramsey who had the Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 8th house. And her case is famous, because in the 1990s, she was murdered in her home, and there was this huge mystery surrounding who did it. And to this day, it actually still continues to be a sort of unsolved mystery, although there’s a lot of different theories surrounding it and theories surrounding who may have done it or who didn’t and a lot of mysteriousness and confusion and things like that basically surrounding her death.
So here’s her chart I will show really quickly here just to confirm the placement. So we see she has Gemini rising, and Neptune at 12 degrees of Capricorn conjunct Saturn at 20 degrees of Capricorn in a night chart. And one of the things that’s interesting about this recently, we’ve been seeing a lot of instances where there’s people born under a Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and then in different ways, now that Saturn and Neptune are conjoining in the sky again, it’s acting as a recurrence transit. And sometimes those people are coming up in the news again, or there’s like, an important turning point taking place with respect to their story. And interestingly, I was just looking this case up and in the news, September 24th through 25th as the Saturn-Neptune conjunction was building up – because they’ve been copresent in the same sign ever since March of 2023 when Saturn moved into Pisces with Neptune – they were developing a Paramount Plus limited series about her life. But the most recent news was that in late October of 2025, there were reports saying that Paramount may end up shelving that series indefinitely due to legal concerns where, for example, her father John Ramsey has publicly indicated that he might take legal action against the series. So there’s still a lot of stuff surrounding that, and it’ll be interesting to see if that is something that continues to be an ongoing story as Saturn and Neptune are conjoining and still copresent over the next year or two.
But the takeaway for me was just sometimes Saturn-Neptune conjunctions can involve a lot of mysteriousness and a lot of different theories and a lot of, yeah, things going on that just aren’t clear. And in this instance, because it was in her 8th house, it very literally was a mystery surrounding her death and how she died. So we’ll see some other ones like that later in terms of mysteriousness.
Actually, why don’t I bring up one of the other ones now? Another one that’s just like that is I noticed that John F. Kennedy had a Saturn-Neptune conjunction across the 10th and 11th houses. And I thought this was really interesting because he was assassinated in 1963, and it’s been one of the biggest things in the past century in terms of different theories about sometimes like, conspiracy theories for lack of a better term or other theories about what the motivation was behind the shooting, if there was like, another shooter involved, if there were, like, who was involved if there were other people besides the guy that was caught and was implicated in the shooting and different things like that. So basically, JFK had a Saturn-Neptune conjunction up at the top of his chart, and I just find it fascinating that the different theories and conspiracy theories surrounding his death has been like, one of the biggest let’s say attractions over the course of the past century for different reasons, because there are some genuinely mysterious things surrounding it.
So that’s an example of that. And then obviously more recently the more recent one is the case that’s happening with Jeffrey Epstein, and that’s obviously become the main case of this current Saturn-Neptune conjunction since he was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 10th house. And on the one hand, there’s a lot of things coming out about how he was working behind the scenes and doing things. There’s a lot of different in some instances, like, conspiracy theories that have been confirmed about things that he was doing. In other instances, there’s like, pretty far out there conspiracy theories that are still not validated but that people are talking about and are sort of like, circulating right now that he’s having this recurrence of Saturn conjunct Neptune. I talked about some of that in some of the recent episodes, so I’m not gonna get too much into it again here. But that’s just another one of those cases where I’ve learned a lot during this cycle and seeing this recurrence transit for him where obviously a lot of it has to do with things that happen behind the scenes and things that are hidden or sometimes conspiracies that are happening behind the scenes, which is one of the keywords that Nick and I found the original episode a year ago. But then also sometimes on conjunctions, there can be disclosures of things that were happening behind the scenes or something that suddenly comes out into the open.
Like for example, in a recent episode, I talked about or I showed how the Sons of Liberty were involved in the Boston Tea Party, which was under a Saturn-Neptune conjunction, where you had this like, secretive group of people that dressed up and then threw all the tea into the harbor and committed this act, but did so as part of a secret group and tried to keep their identities somewhat hidden. But then recently in December, a historical society published a whole list of the names of all the verified members of the people that were involved in the Boston Tea Party for the first time. So there was like, a disclosure centuries later about something that was secret in the past. And I keep seeing that dynamic come up over and over again at different points, and it’s one that I’m paying attention to in different ways.
Maybe to keep that theme going, another one that’s similar that I noticed that it’s in the news right now is Gisele Pelicot, who – this is a really tricky case, so if you haven’t heard of it, you know, trigger warning, because it involved this case in France where a woman who was married was being drugged by her husband and abused and also abused by like, other people in the community. And it came out over the course of the past few years in this landmark trial that happened in 2024, and it was a huge case in France. And she has a Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and basically found out that he’d been drugging her for years and doing all these terrible things. And she’s having a recurrence transit right now, which on the one hand was the trial itself where even though she could have had the case – done the case – privately because of what it involved, she chose to have the trial publicly in order to bring light to this issue, essentially, and to disclose this issue of what was happening and to try to help, you know, potentially other people in the future by making this more public.
So interestingly, just yesterday, I’d already been researching this but then I just found out today that just yesterday on February 17th, just three days before the Saturn-Neptune conjunction goes exact, she’s having a recurrence transit, and she just published an official memoir talking about her story and sharing it with the world. And that’s a really stunning example of, again, this idea of a recurrence transit that I’ve been talking about so much over the past few months because I just see it happening so regularly and frequently where if somebody is born with a exact alignment or an aspect between two planets, then oftentimes something really important will happen in their life later on when those same two planets align again. And in some instances, like with Saturn and Neptune conjunctions, that doesn’t happen frequently because these two planets only conjoin every 36 years or so. So it makes it even more stunning when you see it in those instances of somebody that will only have, you know, what, two, maybe three alignments of that, tops. Probably just two alignments of that, tops, in their natural lifetime, but nonetheless having it be such an important turning point. And for her, it has to do with publishing her memoir and sharing her story and bringing light to this.
And one of the things that it brings up that I talked about on a recent episode I think in the past month was just how sometimes in the original Saturn-Neptune episode, we saw a number of high profile incidents involving chemicals or poisoning and different things like that. And I think her case is another example of that because it involves, you know, she was being not just like, secretly drugged, but it involves a drugging or a sort of poisoning as a sort of theme at the same time. So that was something that Nick and I found in the original episode, but it’s continued to become more and more prominent. And we’ve seen at least two other instances of that recently where, as I mentioned in another episode, I think one of the US governmental agencies just put out a report saying that like, incidents of spouses poisoning their spouse are on the rise recently for some reason, so much so that they decided to put out a notification about it to try to get the word out to help curb this. And then another poisoning news story that was just in the news a few days ago was – I think it was like, the UK or a few other countries put out this announcement saying that Navalny, the opposition leader in Russia, was poisoned, and they said that it was a specific poison from a tree frog or something like that – like a poisonous frog – but they had identified the exact poison that was used to kill him. So that was another instance of this weird like, poisoning theme coming up again which we had found in the original episode, but it’s been striking watching that come up in different ways again over the course of this particular conjunction.
All right. So there’s a lot of other things involving that case, but I’m not gonna go into it, so I’ll move on and leave it there. Let me see what my other examples are.
So I mentioned Navalny, so it might be worth mentioning at this point, you know, one of the Saturn-Neptune conjunctions in – the Saturn in Libra conjunction in the early 1950s was Vladimir Putin, and one of the things I came to a realization about the other day was, you know, his first recurrence transit of that conjunction was in 1989 and around that time period where the Berlin Wall fell and then the Soviet Union broke up and there was the dissolution of the Soviet Union, which was the big Saturn-Neptune event that took place in the late ‘80s and early ‘90s under that conjunction, which was the last conjunction we’ve had prior to this one.
But that conjunction and the fall of the Soviet Union or dissolution of the Soviet Union and the fall of the Berlin Wall was incredibly important to Putin because he was a KGB agent in East Germany who was actually like, witnessing the fall of the Berlin Wall at that time. And I think he’s said that the break up of the Soviet Union was like, one of the greatest geopolitical disasters of the 20th century or something like that. But obviously, it was very personally important to him, and what I realized recently is essentially ever since that time, he’s been in the process of trying to build Russia back up from that point from when that break up happened. And in some instances, trying to bring certain things back from the past in some sense, all the way up until today where we’re at the current Saturn-Neptune conjunction and whatever the important turning point is that’s happening right now or that’s about to take place here as that Saturn-Neptune conjunction is going exact. So that one was super personally important, even though the broader thing is that that Saturn-Neptune conjunction was coinciding with this huge event in terms of mundane astrology, we have to remember that sometimes there are certain mundane events that are incredibly or are more important for certain individuals than others, especially people that will end up being influential or world leaders at some point in the future. So really interesting case, and I’m really curious to see, yeah, what the next turning point is with respect to that under this conjunction for Putin personally, but also for Russia in general.
All right. Moving on. One that I found in the last episode that I did that I don’t wanna – we don’t have to talk about extensively, but just to reiterate, I was really blown away when I found that Christopher Columbus was born on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the year 1451, and then he first pitched the idea of exploring a new route to the Indies to the Spanish royals on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction recurrence in the year 1486. So I thought this was incredible, because of, you know, one of the things about that is he had a mistaken idea, and supposedly went to his death eventually – he died thinking that he had discovered an alternative path to the Indies and to like, South Asia basically. But he was completely mistaken. They had actually inadvertently discovered a completely new land mass with the Americas and began to colonize it and enslave the population and all sorts of other terrible things. But it’s interesting in that instance that there was a mistaken understanding about something, or as a result of a mistaken understanding, something else was accomplished basically – that there was the discovery that took place which opened up a whole new era in terms of world history. But it was entirely based on a mistaken premise, and it was a mistaken premise that he, evidently, if the reports are true, went to his deathbed still thinking was the case all the way until the end.
So sometimes it’s a really important thing, and it’s one of the most tricky things with this conjunction is what I’ve been calling the reality distortion field where sometimes it can indicate an area where the person doesn’t have an accurate understanding of reality, or there’s something that’s deceptive or where they’ve been deceived about some certain aspect of their reality. And I’ve realized more and more over the past year that I’ve been watching this conjunction that it’s because both Saturn is actually the ancient planet that had to do with deception, and Neptune is kind of like, the modern planet that also has to do with illusions and deception and things that look real but are not. So it’s like, you put those two planets together, and sometimes it can create an intense sort of reality distortion field in some way, but it may be one that either the person doesn’t know about until later, or it may be one in which the person never really figures out basically. It may just be a blindspot that maybe other people can see, but perhaps they can’t. So, you know, that’s happened and we’ve seen instances like that in other instances like JonBenet Ramsey and the mystery surrounding her death, or with Gisele Pelicot who discovered how she was being deceived and what was happening to her years later. But even then, there was still mysteries surrounding some of it. So that’s a really important theme that I’m starting to get a much better handle on. And something I just noticed after I did the last episode with Christopher Columbus is he may be about to have another recurrence transit, because I saw a notice that Trump and the White House may be getting ready to put up a statue to Christopher Columbus on the White House or near the White House sometime very soon, possibly as soon as in the next couple of weeks from the report that I was seeing, if it was true. And this would be – if that happens, it’s gonna be a recurrence transit for Columbus, something like, more than 500 years after he died. So we’ll have to pay attention to that and see if that actually manifests and comes about, but that’s gonna be kind of crazy if it does, and it’s gonna be a good example that our birth charts continue to live and to speak for as long as our memory is alive and as long as it continues to echo in history in different ways. The astrology will always, any time your name or your memory comes up at some point in the future, especially in a really important or defining way, that sometimes the astrology itself will reflect that in some ways. So we’ll have to pay attention to that case and see if that actually turns out to be the case in that instance. Just as, for example, with Epstein – you know, Epstein has been dead since 2019, and yet in 2025 and 2026 when Saturn and Neptune have come so close, suddenly he becomes – his name becomes – this huge, worldwide phenomenon even though he’s no longer around. So the birth chart continues to live on, especially as long as our memory does and our impact on the world continues to reverberate in history.
All right. So let’s move onto the next one. Another one that I found, an older one, is Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa who famously wrote the Three Books of Occult Philosophy. He was born on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction. And I did a whole episode a few years ago on Agrippa and his work, because he wrote like, what became a classic book on magic and the occult, basically, of everything he knew or had learned about that subject. And it became a standard reference volume for ceremonial magicians and people like that in the future. And it was interesting, because it was like, focusing on occultism and the structure of the hidden arts, but what was interesting about him that I thought was curious is I did read at one point that towards the end of his life, he may have turned skeptical against magic and the occult. And this is an interesting tension that I sometimes see come up that I think Richard Tarnas talked about in his treatment of Saturn-Neptune when he was talking about different figures like Charles Darwin, for example, because Darwin famously was born on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction the same day as Abraham Lincoln. And both of them manifested that conjunction in different ways. But with Darwin, his work on the theory of evolution ended up causing huge tensions with religious people and the religious community because it showed this alternative scientific way of explaining how life came about and how humans came about on earth that was different than, you know, whatever it says in the Bible about how humans and earth were created. So it created this more of a science versus religion divide, which is one of the things that we see come up during Saturn-Neptune conjunctions. And Nick and I had documented a few instances of that in the episode a year ago. Like, for example, I can’t remember the conjunction, but in the late 1800s, there was like, a society dedicated to studying psychic or paranormal things in a scientific or skeptical context that was created on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction.
So I think we see something similar with Agrippa where even though he’s known as having written this big book on magic, there may have been a tension within him about like, science versus magic or belief versus skepticism or what have you that showed up in different ways in his life. And I think that’s an important dynamic to be aware of when it comes to this conjunction, because Saturn represents that which is real and that which is tangible and like, the tangible structure of the universe, whereas Neptune represents things that are more either spiritually inclined or things that make sense in abstract but may not have like, a tangible reality and different things like that. And sometimes you see a tension between those two worlds – of the world that is real versus the world that is not real in some sense – when that alignment takes place. So I think we’ll come back to that later as a theme.
All right. So let’s move on. You know, another one I’ve mentioned over the past year is Taylor Swift, because she was born during the Saturn-Neptune conjunction and she’s having the recurrence now. And last summer, of course, when the Saturn-Neptune conjunction came really close again but it didn’t go exact, that was when her partner, Travis Kelce, and her got engaged and announced their engagement. And we don’t have like, a confirmed birth time for her, so we don’t know for sure what house it’s falling in in her chart. But I just realized recently that we actually do a birth time for Travis Kelce, and the Saturn-Neptune conjunction natally is in his 5th house. So I think now, even at least through that, we can kind of understand better why this Saturn-Neptune conjunction might be coming up in a romantic context for that couple – certainly in his chart. And they announced their engagement last summer when Saturn and Neptune came close, and then I think they’re about to get married sometime this year. I think reports were saying in June, maybe close to the Venus-Jupiter conjunction, but we’ll see what ends up happening.
A similar one like that I was looking at recently is Kathleen Kennedy, who was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 1950s in Libra, and she’s a really famous and influential Hollywood producer. And… How to tell this story? She’s somebody that worked with Steven Spielberg and George Lucas. And in 2012, she actually took over when George Lucas sold his company, which had the rights to Star Wars and stuff; that was the main thing that his company did – Lucas Film. Kathleen Kennedy became the president of that in 2012 and left her previous production company, and then that’s what led to – and she was kind of at the helm of creating all of the new Star Wars franchises and everything like that. But interestingly, just recently on January 15th, as the Saturn-Neptune conjunction is going exact again, she announced that she’s officially stepping down as president of Lucas Film. And so it’s this conjunction is bringing an end to a really important chapter in terms of her career as this really famous not just producer, but also in this instance the president of an entire film studio and the person who had the final say about the direction of the Star Wars sequel trilogy and everything else – all the television shows and things like that.
And so with that, we have a birth time for her, and what I found was interesting was that her conjunction is in the 7th house. And at first, I didn’t really understand how that manifested, but I was researching and it turns out she has a partner who she worked with really closely on producing movies in the 1980s, and then they actually ended up getting married in the 1980s at one point, I think not too far off from the conjunction. I wanna say it was like, ‘87 or ‘88 or something like that, which would be close to her first recurrence of Saturn and Neptune. And then in 1991, the two of them founded the Kennedy/Marshall Company, which was this incredibly successful and prolific and respected production house in Hollywood where after that, they ended up producing really huge movies such as like, The Sixth Sense in 1999, Seabiscuit in 2003, Munich in 2005, The Curious Case of Benjamin Button in 2008 – that’s actually one of my favorite movies – Lincoln in 2012 by Steven Spielberg, the Bourne franchise – like, The Bourne Identity and all the subsequent movies in that franchise – Signs in 2002 by M. Night Shyamalan, and the Jurassic World trilogy that’s been such a huge trilogy over the past decade.
So suddenly, the Saturn-Neptune conjunction makes sense in that context in her chart, because it’s really pointing to her 7th house being important and yeah, working together with her partner to create this huge production company I think was part of that. But a lot of it is also that she was – in acting as a producer and then heading up Lucas Film, it’s like, she was doing something with film which is like, about art, but she was very much on the structural side of that in terms of producing and managing and sort of directing things from a business standpoint that are ultimately like, artistic or cinematic creations. And you know, there’s lots of debates about how that ended up going with the Star Wars sequels that we don’t have to get into here in terms of that and that legacy, but it’s interesting how those important turning points of forming that production company with her partner under the late ‘80s and early ‘90s conjunction and then bringing something to a close at this point with that second recurrence transit conjunction. And it’s a good reminder that sometimes conjunctions are the start of a new cycle and the birth of something new, but in other instances, it’s the end of a cycle and it’s bringing something to completion at the end of a very long period of time. So keep that in mind when it comes to looking at these conjunctions.
Let’s see. Another one – one of the charts in my files was somebody named Stephen Paddock who had the conjunction in the 4th house, and he ended up becoming a mass shooter, basically. I think he was involved in the Vegas shooting a few years ago, which was, yeah – he was a mass murderer. He perpetrated the 2017 Las Vegas shooting. And I think it was one of the largest shootings in US history, basically.
But what was interesting about his chart is that his Saturn-Neptune conjunction fell in the 4th house. And I had noticed at one point a weird thing about his biography, which is that his father evidently was a prominent bank robber who was arrested in 1960 when Stephen was seven years old. And this guy was later convicted and escaped prison in 1969 and appeared on the FBI’s most wanted list. And I found this quote from his brother, Eric, who said the father “was never with my mom, and we didn’t grow up under his influence.” And after the father was arrested, their mother told the children that the father had died in a car accident and kept his status as a bank robber a secret from the family.
So Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 4th house and like, the father was a criminal but also his criminality was kept secret as a sort of like, mystery or even as a lie by the mother. And then later, they would grow up and find out at some point in the future. So again, it’s sometimes that theme of there’s something that’s not clear or that’s hidden or that’s being distorted in some instances deliberately by somebody that you later find out about. And I thought that was fascinating in some ways and may also have played into his psychology at some point when he ends up growing up to be this mass shooter.
Okay, so moving on. Let me find some other interesting ones. There was one I knew – I was thinking about recently of somebody I knew who had a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 4th house, to give a more positive example, and they had the Saturn-Neptune conjunction from the 1950s. And then at the recurrence in the 1980s, they completed training in ayurvedic medicine, which is like, Indian medicine. And they founded an ashram on the Saturn-Neptune conjunction at that time in order to provide sort of ayurvedic and spiritually-oriented health and medical advice to people, basically, as a medical co-op. And I thought that was fascinating, having it in the 4th house and the idea of forming an ashram or yeah, like, a place for health and wellness but that’s tied in with one’s religious and sort of spiritual views about things in terms of the home and the living place and things like that. And people would come to visit and get treatment for different things and would be prescribed herbs or other health regimes in connection with ayurvedic medicine. So I thought that was a really cool manifestation to give you a more positive example of like, a 4th house Saturn-Neptune conjunction.
I’ve seen so many times, just as an aside, Saturn-Neptune conjunctions being really important in the founding of different religious communities was a major thing that came up during the original Saturn-Neptune episode, but like, continues to be a really obvious theme that I’ve found other instances of that at different points in history over the course of the past year that I’ve continued researching this more. Because it’s like, you have Neptune, which is like, the inspiration or the spiritual side of things, but you put it together with Saturn, which really wants to bring those spiritual ideas or sometimes philosophical ideals into concrete form. And sometimes that can manifest in attempting to create a physical structure or community or location that’s in alignment with one’s religious or philosophical or just political ideals in some instances.
Under similar things, I have a birth chart I’ve used before for the Mercury Cafe, which was a local place in Denver for many years. And it was founded during the 1989 Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and the business opened one day I believe in 1990 with Scorpio rising and the Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 3rd house. And I found that really fascinating, because it was like, a restaurant, but it was also a place that had like, a stage, and it was very community-oriented in terms of the local community and in terms of organizing local community events surrounding an ideal. But one thing in particular it did was it hosted – and how I first came to start going to the Mercury Cafe – is they would host these poetry readings and poetry competitions or poetry slams. And that’s part of the 3rd house connection there with Saturn-Neptune in the 3rd house of communication was literally hosting and creating community events related to poetry, so that for a period of time it was just this place everybody would go to in Denver for those poetry slams. And there were some very famous poets that kind of got their start there and then went on to be successful – like Andrea Gibson, for example, would read poetry there, and a number of other people. So that was an interesting one. And also in the 3rd house, the 3rd house also has to do with neighbors and communities, and it was a very community-oriented place around especially politically in terms of wanting to do good things in the community that were especially like, more progressive and things like that. So that was an instance where Neptune can be taking your higher ideals and trying to bring it into concrete form by creating a physical space for it. And in that sense, because it was the 3rd house, it had to do with like, the local community.
All right. Other examples. A funny one that I found that was a Saturn-Neptune conjunction when I was researching is Haley Joel Osment, who was an actor that had the Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 12th house. And I thought that was really funny, because his most famous and impactful role was he was like, the child actor in the movie The Sixth Sense. And his most famous line – like, spoilers if you haven’t seen The Sixth Sense, I think everyone’s seen it at this point – but his most famous line was, “I see dead people.” And I thought that was incredible, having a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 12th house and it’s like, his most famous role is this movie where he’s like, a little boy and he can see people who are dead that are like, ghosts, but nobody else can see them. And he’s able to be like, the go-between in between these two worlds of those that have passed away versus those that are still living. And that becomes like, the focal point for the movie. And we kind of see that sometimes when it comes to actors and some of their most famous or iconic roles sometimes speak to a chart placement that they have. And that’s true not just of actors, but other creatives as well, where sometimes your chart speaks to what you end up creating in the world, even if it’s something where you’re like, acting or it’s like, a creative thing that you’re doing rather than something that’s like, about you psychologically or something like that – like, some action that you’re taking in your own life. But I thought that was a really interesting and fascinating example.
All right. Another one, to go back to the 3rd house, is Ken Burns, the documentary filmmaker. He has a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 3rd house. I think it’s really interesting how – he’s really famous for doing these documentaries, especially documentaries about major historic events in American history. Like, for example, a recent one that he did was a whole documentary series on the American Revolution. And it’s like, communicating and telling a story, but he’s also doing so by doing recreations so that he’s recreating the images and the scenarios in order to try to give you a sense of the feeling of that time period. And sometimes he’ll use like, quotes from people’s diaries and have actors read those quotes during the course of the documentary to give you a real sense of like, what people were thinking or feeling during that time period. But I think that’s cool – the idea of having it in the 3rd house of communication and choosing to speak about history through the medium of cinema, basically, I think is part of what’s happening there.
Another 3rd house one is I knew somebody once that had a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 3rd house, and they were really focused on this idea of like, the ambiguity of language and the importance of definitions but also sometimes the idea of like, reading into the deeper or sometimes hidden meanings of words and texts. And that was like, a major focus for them was this idea of like, the ambiguity in language itself and how sometimes what looks like it’s written on the surface, that sometimes there’s other things that are written below the surface that you really have to think hard about and dig to see in order to understand what’s actually being conveyed. So that was another 3rd house manifestation I was like, reflecting on recently that I thought was really interesting and insightful.
Another Saturn-Neptune conjunction is I know somebody who was like, an astrologer but who kind of goes back and forth between whether they’re an astrologer versus whether they’re not an astrologer – whether they believe in astrology or whether they’re just interested in astrology from a historical standpoint and oftentimes is kind of like, ambiguous about what they are at different points in their life and at different points in their life will sort of go back and forth. And this idea of ambiguity is a really crucial one when it comes to Saturn-Neptune conjunctions that oftentimes – especially depending on the house placement – there can be these themes surrounding ambiguity and even ambivalence and sometimes like, going back and forth. And it kind of reminds me of one of the things we focused on in the original Saturn-Neptune episode is how there were all these things involving the ambiguities between borders and physical borders. And sometimes that was like, ambiguities over borders between countries, for example, or places. But other times, it could be ambiguity surrounding timezones, for example. Like, some of the first time zones were set up at an important date during a Saturn-Neptune conjunction we found in the original episode. Or another one was like, house division comes up in astrology at different points over the past decade when a Saturn-Neptune conjunction or Saturn-Neptune squares come up – so 2017, for example, was a big year where house division was being discussed a lot in astrology at that time under that Saturn-Neptune square.
Another one that was really interesting I was reflecting on recently was Geoffrey Cornelius and his work about astrology and divination, and sometimes arguments about whether astrology is divination or whether it’s scientific are connected with Saturn-Neptune alignments and the ambiguity and sort of distinction between those two things. So that’s something I’ll probably save for later, because that’s something I’d like to do a whole episode on at some point. But those are some other themes that are coming up for me recently.
All right. Going back, I was looking at some in the 1800s. An interesting one that came up was Edgar Allan Poe was born under the Saturn-Neptune conjunction around 1809, and he was the master of the dark poem and the dream within a dream, and I thought that was really brilliant and beautiful. Sometimes there can be a dark component to Saturn, depending on how it’s situated with Neptune, and in some instances it can be like, the higher ideal and the rosy aspirational dream, but in other instances it can be really more of a dark or pessimistic kind of like, nightmare type situation. And we see that going back and forth in different ways, and even coming up with some of the things that are happening in the news in the late 1980s or 2025 and 2026.
Another one that was interesting from the 1800s is that Neptune itself was discovered on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and this was fascinating because astronomers ended up using mathematical calculations in order to find the planet and kind of infer where it was where it had only previously been kind of like, a mathematical suspicion or like a ghost that was out there. But they were able to find it because they had this like, sense that it existed at that point and ended up finding it. So a Saturn-Neptune conjunction and also breaking down the barriers between what could be seen versus the unseen.
A really old one – I was looking to see what was like, the oldest chart that I could find with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction for like, a confirmed birthdate, and one of the ones in my files was the ancient Neoplatonic philosopher Proclus, who was born in the year 412 around a Saturn-Neptune conjunction at that point. And he was one of the last great Neoplatonists who attempted to build this massive kind of rigid system of logic to encompass all of mystical and religious thought. And he was kind of like, one of the last great pagan philosophers of the Platonic or Neoplatonic tradition, and Neoplatonism had gotten very complicated at that point. But one of the things that he wrote was a book of sort of like, definitions related to Neoplatonism. And it’s interesting seeing that he was like, a very systematic thinker, but he was being very systematic and thinking about Neoplatonism, which has this very complex system of religious and spiritual doctrine, basically. And I thought that was interesting in terms of him being one of the last great philosophers of that tradition.
All right. Let me see if there’s any others that I meant to mention before I wrap up here.
Okay, two more interesting ones. One of them that was kind of interesting is Pierce Brosnan was born on the 1953 conjunction, and he’s most famous for playing the role of the spy James Bond, which in and of itself I thought was kind of interesting when it comes to we’re talking about this like, secretive or hidden thing, and the idea of him being a secret agent in his most iconic role ever starting in the 1990s. But I was researching his biography a little bit, and interestingly, at his first recurrence in 1989, that was the exact year that he was originally set to take over as James Bond, but then there were contract disputes that ended up delaying it. And this recurrence kind of marked the moment that his dream role started to become this professional, tangible reality. And I think just a few years later eventually in the mid-’90s, he would actually take over that role in the first movie, GoldenEye, which was like, his first film as James Bond. So I thought that was a cool one in terms of, again, that theme of spies, things that are covert, covert operations, but sometimes that coming out through the characters that a person creates or plays as a creative or as an artist in some instances, where in other instances it’s like, you have people like Vladimir Putin who is like, literally a KGB agent and was playing out a role like that in a very much more literal, like actual sense.
Another one – this one I didn’t know about, but Elvira, Mistress of the Dark – I don’t know if people remember her, but she was really prominent in the 1980s, and she had this goth aesthetic. And the Saturn-Neptune conjunction was in her first house; she was born with Libra rising, so she had the Saturn-Neptune in the first house. And let’s see, AstroDatabank has a write-up for her, and it says she was “the daughter of a salesman and a mom who had a costume shop, and at two she was scalded by boiling water and eventually had to have the scars corrected with cosmetic surgery.” So that’s the like, Saturn in the first house of having a negative physical event happening to the body and the appearance, but also possibly the Neptune and the cosmetic surgery. And then later it says – it goes on, it says, “She became a Las Vegas showgirl and sang with a rock band that did a gig in Italy. Then back in Los Angeles in 1971, she played in television bit parts and waited tables for her steady job. When she joined a comedy troupe, her horror hostess costume was an immediate big hit, and she vamped and camped it up. So by the late 1980s, Elvira was such a recognizable cult favorite that she was marketing Elvira costumes, comic books, cartoons, paraphernalia, and hosting video thrillers. Every year near Halloween, she arises again from the crypt, so to speak.” And interestingly, her like, fame was so much in playing this gothic character basically that they released a movie in 1988, which is under that Saturn-Neptune conjunction recurrence, titled Elvira: Mistress of the Dark. So I thought that was an amazing and funny one in terms of Saturn-Neptune in the first house, and in some instances, you know, she had a physical thing that happened that was really difficult for her, but also this idea of dressing up in a costume or having one’s appearance be different than what it actually is or also it’s kind of similar to the Edgar Allan Poe example, but here in the first house it’s like, having a darker or gothic aesthetic basically was part of what happened there.
All right. Another example is Alexander Graham Bell, who was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction crossing his 12th and first whole sign houses. And on the one hand, I’ve talked about his story before in a number of examples – a number of episodes – but he inventing and promoting the telephone, part of his story was about breaking down borders between the hearing and people that are unable to hear or are hearing impaired. And part of the story for that is like, his own mother had hearing difficulty, so he partially wanted to do that in order to help her. But then he was involved in doing different things working with the hearing impaired for the entirety of his life and then ended up inventing the telephone. Although interestingly, there was ambiguity and debates over whether he was the actual first inventor of the telephone or there was another woman who also claimed to have invented it and some nebulousness actually about what the correct answer is surrounding that, which I found really fascinating in terms of the mystery surrounding that and who the true inventor really is.
Another one I found is Gwendolyn Brooks, who had the Saturn-Neptune conjunction across the 11th and 12th house. And she was an American writer and the author of more than 20 books, and she was the poet laureate of the state of Illinois from 1969. So she ended up being a winner of the Pulitzer Prize for literature, and in 1989, she received a Lifetime Achievement Award from the National Endowments for the Arts. So what I found incredible about her story is just being born with the Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and then eventually on the 1989 recurrence, she received the Lifetime Achievement Award for her work as a poet and as a writer, which is an incredible example of a recurrence transit.
In terms of art, Pablo Picasso had a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 10th house. And I really like this example because of especially his work on Cubism and the work that he did on Cubism is really evocative for me of Saturn and Neptune, because it’s like, art and painting but he’s bringing this blockiness to forms, which at first might look – it looks weird or looks like not artistic, especially as a break with the previous art up to that point. But thinking about Cubism in that context as part of a Saturn-Neptune thing I think is really interesting and expressive in terms of that.
He also had a recurrence in 1917 where he traveled to Italy and began designing for the Ballet Russes, and this marked a shift from what historians call his “blue period” which was more about sadness and things like that into a more structured classical phase of his career. So that’s something I’d love to explore at some point is just different artists and how they paint or express themselves as an expression either of Saturn-Neptune alignments in this instance or other planetary alignments that might be more descriptive of their art and their creativity, as well as how those recurrence transits sometimes line up with shifts in terms of their career and their artistic output.
A more recent one I found that was interesting is Daniel Radcliffe was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in 1989, and he’s of course most well-known for playing Harry Potter as a young or as a child actor in the 2000s. And on the one hand, that’s kind of interesting that he played the role of a wizard in this iconic set of movies from the 2000s, but he’s having a recurrence transit right now and there’s two things about that that I find interesting. One is that he’s currently on like, a press run right now because he’s receiving peak critical acclaim for his recent career-defining theatrical roles, and at this point, this recurrence is kind of successfully in some ways dissolving the ghost of Harry Potter as he’s sort of establishing himself as a permanent and respected figure in terms of the acting world outside of that role. And I think that’s one piece of it, just in terms of him establishing himself independent of that.
But then also I guess HBO is shooting a new Harry Potter series, and just in the past year or two – maybe it was just the past year – they announced the new cast and they announced who the new actor is that’s playing the new Harry Potter. So in some ways, the Saturn-Neptune recurrence is also like, in two different ways, him finally starting to be differentiated from that role as an actor on the one hand due to his own skill and acting in theatre and on his own, but also in another sense because now another actor has come along to play that role, and so it will no longer be something that singularly defines only Danial Radcliffe, which I think is a really interesting example of a recurrence in that instance.
One of the themes we oftentimes bring up that we brought up in the mundane episode on Saturn and Neptune a year ago is it coinciding with the fall of empires or the dissolution of empires. And there were a bunch of different examples of this that we found in history in that episode, but there were two birth charts that were interestingly tied in with that that both had Saturn-Neptune conjunctions.
So one of them was for Faud II of Egypt, who had the Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 10th house with Mars. And he was the king of Egypt who ascended the throne as just a baby in 1952 after the forced abdication of his father, King Farouk I. And this child, Faud II, he reigned for less than a year until June of 1953, and he ended up being then effectively the last reigning monarch of Egypt before the monarchy was completely abolished after that point. And it was also the last in his house lineage that had stretched back all the way until 1805. So he ended up being overthrown when the monarchy and the aristocracy was abolished in the 1952 revolution and the Republic of Egypt was proclaimed.
So after being deposed, he was brought to France, but interestingly, one of the primary people that was involved in the Egyptian Revolution, Gamal Abdel Nasser, was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction. And if the time is right, it was in the 9th house. And he played a leading role in the Egyptian Revolution of 1952 which removed the original King Farouk and it temporarily installed his son for a year or two. But then it ushered in this period of industrialization of Egypt and the advancement of sort of nationalism.
So yeah, there’s other things with respect to that, but I just found it fascinating because of course he’s born under a completely different Saturn-Neptune conjunction. But somehow both the final king of Egypt was born with a Saturn-Neptune conjunction and then one of the leading people involved in the revolution is born with an earlier Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and then of course, his recurrence of that conjunction was being involved in the Egyptian revolution in the early 1950s which brought the end or the collapse of that monarchy and the end of that monarchy. So it’s just a fascinating case.
There was another example like that, actually, of the king of England. King George III was born in 1738 on a Saturn-Neptune conjunction, and he was the king who was the king of England during the American Revolution. So and basically there was a Saturn-Neptune conjunction that led up to the American Revolution during the Boston Tea Party, for example, so that would have been a recurrence transit for him where basically all of the American colonists start getting really rowdy and start to revolt. And one of the things I found interesting about that as I was learning more about the American Revolution recently and watching different documentaries on it was initially the people involved in the American Revolution were complaining about – and they were directing most of their like, hatred towards – the British parliament who were the ones that they thought were the ones that were like, raising the taxes and doing things that felt like overreaches to them that made them want to rebel.
But then eventually, somewhat late in the process, it’s like, they were writing letters to the king asking him – the colonists were asking the king, King George, to intervene on their behalf and advocate for them. But he basically like, didn’t, and ignored them, and then eventually late in the process, the colonists turned their anger towards the king himself and declared that the king was not doing his job and protecting them or other things like that or was doing inappropriate actions. And then this eventually leads to the Declaration of Independence and declaring the colonies to be independent countries rather than connected with the British crown up to that point or from that point forward.
So I thought that was fascinating because, again, this is another instance of Saturn-Neptune sometimes representing the decline or dissolution of empires. And sometimes the people that are involved in the dissolution of the empire themself have Saturn-Neptune conjunctions in their birth chart. And in this instance, it’s a really brilliant case study in terms of King George having that, and then having the American Revolution kicking off being part of his recurrence transit, basically. So really cool stuff. Yeah.
All right, so I think that’s it. I think that’s all I got to say. I’ve got a few other examples, but I think that’s probably good. Now, I realize this wasn’t like, one – fully comprehensive, like I said it would not be at the beginning, and two – it’s also kind of not super well put together. But I just wanted to share, especially since the conjunction is going exact, some of the research I’ve been doing just to give you an idea of some of the different threads that I’ve been picking up on as I’ve been researching these Saturn-Neptune conjunctions recently, and to sort of put something out there in honor of the current conjunction that’s going exact just in the next few days.
So I’m sure there’s tons of other examples I missed. And I would love to hear in the comments if you find a good example; please let me know in the comments section on YouTube, because that’s where I usually pay attention to comments and then it helps me to pool some of those examples and resources where – especially I’m looking for other good examples of celebrities or notable figures whose lives are documented that are good examples of Saturn-Neptune conjunctions. So if you have a good one of those, then please post it in the YouTube comments.
Additionally, if you have a conjunction in your own personal life, if you have it in your chart, and you have some particular insight into that conjunction – especially the house placement that it’s in and how it manifests in that specific house and that specific area of your life – then definitely let me know in a comment on YouTube as well. And with any luck, I’ll keep compiling these, and if people would like to, I could do a follow-up episode talking about either additional celebrity examples that I find or I could do another episode talking about individual examples that are sent in by listeners and then maybe interviewing some people about those conjunctions. Or I could also do a follow-up episode dedicated to collecting a bunch of recurrence transit examples of people that were born on the conjunction and then had something really important happen to them under a subsequent conjunction. And again, if you have examples of that, either in your personal life or celebrity examples, then definitely let me know, and with any luck I’ll get enough to do a follow-up episode.
All right. I think that’s it for this episode, so thanks a lot everybody for watching or listening to this episode of the podcast. Good luck with the Saturn-Neptune conjunction happening over the course of the next week. And I’ll see you again next time!
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